Discussion High Rankings vs. Low Rankings - What did you do differently?

[Hondo]

Great reading in here.

My 2nd season of playing Supercoach is the year Hondo is talking about above. I started the year with both Dangerfield and Sidebottom and got on to Beams just as his huge break out started which propelled me into the top 100 where I stayed most of the year. Being my 2nd year playing I ran out of trades early but still ended up finishing with a great placement somewhere between 100-150.
I think ever since then I've been trying to repeat what happened that season and even though I consider myself a much better coach now I've never been able to get close to that result. Every year since then I've started a number of midpricers with some pretty poor results (Harry O, Lonergan etc) and so this year I've decided to try and go guns n rookies or at least no speculative break out picks. At the moment the only midpriced player I have in my team is Beams although I have been considering Sandi.
After a terrible finals run last year where I made the top 4 in 4 different cash leagues and went out in straight sets in all 4 leagues I made a few rules for the following year. 1. No midprices 2. No key forwards (after Gunstons 45 in a final) 3. No players over 30 (after Bartels 45 in a final) I probably won't stick to all these but it's there to remind me of some of the mistakes I've made in previous seasons.
In the end it does come down a lot to luck. The last couple of seasons I've started with admittedly terrible starting teams but have had a lot of bad luck too (Stef Martin getting knocked out, Nic Nat injury getting Tippet in them him getting injured) but have managed to claw my way back with some pretty good trading to around the 5000 mark at the end of the season. I feel like I just need a little bit of luck and a bit better starting side (no midpricers?) and I might get another shot at a top 100 finish.

Yes this is what happens to a lot of us. We try to replicate what we did in our most successful year which seems to be one of our first years playing the game.

The winner from each year usually is someone we have never heard of who springs up from low previous ranks or is their 1st or 2nd year only playing the game. My theory is that in the early years of playing SC you tend to play the cards you are dealt with in that season and not get hung up on the ghosts of the past and rules that come from those ghosts.

You also tend to not be influenced by forums because you are new to the game. I think this can help you run with your instinct (noting that forums are a great resource in their own right with the downside being your unique player or approach can tend to get shot down by your peers).

The longer we player the more we revert to our "rules" for success and while these are important I do believe they can get in the way of playing the current season on it's merits. I reckon there is a freedom in being new and fresh to the game that can get lost the longer you play.

In my first year playing (2009) I traded in Dane Swan who at the time was seen as a DT only player. I made this move on my own after looking at this scores to date at the time. The SC veterans at the time all stayed away from him. He went on to become a key SC player that year almost eclipsing Gaz. Had I been in year 2 or later the "rule" of "don't pick Dane Swan" would have made me leave him. I was naïve and it worked.

Some years a GnR works best, other years value picks turn out to be the best, other years a combination. I think each season is unique and to some extent needs to be played in a unique way, not in the way that worked for us 3 years ago.

 

[KLo30]

2015 was my first full season, when I was in year 12, and I committed the majority of my time to SuperCoach

SuperCoach Finals Edition 2014 piqued my interest, I gave it a go and thus started my 2015 pre-season. Before any sort of team picker or planner was available, I would take my selections (with predicted price and position) down on a Microsoft Word document. I spent hours each and every day over the summer and drafted countless sides. When the season started, I would spend hours researching, second-guessing and researching some more, for each and every trade.

I remember starting Mumford, expecting him to go huge in the first few rounds. Upon scoring below the ton, I traded him in round 2 to Tex Walker, who had opened the season with a big 177. This decision alone was the biggest mistake I made in 2015.

I made some excellent use of the VC loophole, with my captain's average score being 141.36. My big highlight was locking in Priddis' 196 vs. Gold Coast in the wet west.

At the end of the season, I finished with a ranking of 790, which I am quite proud of now, although at the time I was bummed to miss out on top 500. Following the season, I made a Word Document of "Ten Commandments of Supercoach" or something along those lines, with examples and all. If I can find it on an old USB, I'll be sure to post it somewhere on the site.

I headed into the 2016 season with high hopes of a top 500 finish. I didn't get off to a flyer like in 2015 (but I didn't make any knee-jerk trades either). Halfway through the season, I must have been closing in on top 10k. Life got in the way, I had a few troubles, some personal issues and a jam-packed assignment schedule at uni and I lost my passion for the game. Somehow I managed to keep making decent and level-headed trades right through to the end of the season, but I didn't have the time to put into research and so the quality of my trades probably suffered. I finished the season ranked about 7k (I didn't care enough to record my exact final rank, which I regret now).

So the biggest differences between my successful and not so successful seasons were: time for planning/research, captain choices, and overall passion and enthusiasm for the game.

Hopefully I can get back on track and make top 500 in 2017.

Home > Team History > 2016

 

[BomberSam]

Home > Team History > 2016

Wow. That's incredible, thanks KLo. My rank was exactly 8,388.

 

[Prochard]

Was top 50 by round 10 in 2015 without the number 1 scorer Fyfe.
Was top 10k by round 10 in 2016 with the number 1 scorer Dangerfield

mmmmmmm

 

[Fiasco]

Yes this is what happens to a lot of us. We try to replicate what we did in our most successful year which seems to be one of our first years playing the game.

The winner from each year usually is someone we have never heard of who springs up from low previous ranks or is their 1st or 2nd year only playing the game. My theory is that in the early years of playing SC you tend to play the cards you are dealt with in that season and not get hung up on the ghosts of the past and rules that come from those ghosts.

You also tend to not be influenced by forums because you are new to the game. I think this can help you run with your instinct (noting that forums are a great resource in their own right with the downside being your unique player or approach can tend to get shot down by your peers).

The longer we player the more we revert to our "rules" for success and while these are important I do believe they can get in the way of playing the current season on it's merits. I reckon there is a freedom in being new and fresh to the game that can get lost the longer you play.

In my first year playing (2009) I traded in Dane Swan who at the time was seen as a DT only player. I made this move on my own after looking at this scores to date at the time. The SC veterans at the time all stayed away from him. He went on to become a key SC player that year almost eclipsing Gaz. Had I been in year 2 or later the "rule" of "don't pick Dane Swan" would have made me leave him. I was naïve and it worked.

Some years a GnR works best, other years value picks turn out to be the best, other years a combination. I think each season is unique and to some extent needs to be played in a unique way, not in the way that worked for us 3 years ago.

Totally agree with this, in my 2nd year playing where I came around the top 150 I wasn't reading forums or listening to podcasts or even talking to anyone about my decisions it was all just on me otherwise I never would have made the Dane Beams trade. I like your thoughts regarding playing each season on its own merits too but I think this season I'm definitely going guns n rookies.

 

[BomberSam]

I managed to find my notes to self following my best (2015) season.

Let's call them the "14 Supercoach Commandments". Examples are from 2015 and may not be entirely accurate. I have added in the "THOU SHALTs" for dramatic purposes.

1. THOU SHALT BACK IN THY PREMIUM- GIVE THEM TIME, i.e. Mumford
2. THOU SHALT NOT CHASE POINTS, i.e. Tex Walker 177
3. THOU SHALT HOLD PLAYERS FOR UP TO 3 WEEKS IF YE HAVE COVER, i.e. Sloane, Rockliff
4. THOU SHALT NOT PICK BREAKOUT CONTENDERS, i.e. Newnes (didn't end up being a bad pick)
5. THOU SHALT ONLY SIDEWAYS FOR A LTI i.e, Mumford out for season
6. THOU SHALT BECOME FULL PREMO AS QUICKLY AS POSSIBLE
7. THOU SHALT BUILD COVER WHEN/IF VALUE PRESENTS- i.e. Ziebell below 400k
8. THOU SHALT HOLD ROOKIES FOR SEASON IF THEY SCORE LIKE A KEEPER, i.e. Saad (more like Adams 2017)
9. THOU SHALT NOT PICK PROVEN PLAYERS WHOM ARE IN POOR FORM UNLESS CHEAP FOR COVER, i.e. Brodie Smith
10. THOU SHALT CREATE DPP LINKS, i.e. Steele with Lambert, Hugh Goddard/Higgins/McGovern, especially focus on this when building cover
11. THOU SHALT PICK A FLOATING DONUT TO LOOP SCORES, i.e. Brenton Payne m/f
12. THOU SHALT INVEST IN RUCK COVER, i.e. Gawn, Bellchambers, McKernan
13. THOU SHALT PICK POPULAR LOCK PLAYERS EVEN IF ZERO POD VALUE, i.e. Rockliff, Bontempelli, not picking them is negative POD
14. THOU SHALT RESIST NAB TEMPTATION, i.e. Lumumba

These may not apply to everyone, but these are my general guidelines. However, I am breaking the 12th commandment this season unless a basement price ruckman steps up.

 

[t.thomas6]

Last year was obviously my most successful year in SC to date, and comparing it to previous years I think I can identify a few changes in my strategy that may have attributed towards that:

Trust your gut. To do well in SC generally requires a great amount of research and skill, but also a great amount of luck. When I picked Max Gawn at the start of last year, did I know he would go on to be the highest averaging ruckman and 3rd highest averaging player of 2016? Absolutely not. I would have guessed that he'd go on to average around 105. But what I did know was that he was about $50,000 cheaper than Stefan Martin, and Naitanui had not played a full season since 2010.
I also trusted my gut with the decision to start Luke Parker over Shiel/Wines despite most SC sites and friends of mine telling me to do otherwise.
Whilst trusting your gut may not always turn out successfully (I picked Sam Gray in my starting lineup last year and traded in Lycett mid-season), it is extremely fulfilling to see a player succeed that you picked based on your own research and gut instinct when the masses chose another player who is not living up to their expectations.

Don't underestimate the bye rounds. I attribute a large portion of my success last year to the bye rounds. Most people view the bye rounds as a hinderance and don't plan for it, you should rather view it as an opportunity. I gained a large amount of ground on the leaders throughout the bye rounds last year, but I was only able to do that through careful planning. In the rounds leading up to the bye rounds, have a rough idea of what trades you are going to make and what your team is going to look like each round including how many players you will have on field. Obviously there may be unexpected injuries or price drops/increases that occur, but these can be easily accounted for by making a few tweaks to your plans. Failing to plan is planning to fail.

Cut your losses early with mid-pricers. At the end of every year, many coaches who have not had success swear they will never get sucked into the trap of "pre-season hyped" mid-pricers, but the next season rolls around and they are falling into the same temptation and have already forgotten about their last season promise. I have done this myself a few times. And whilst it's true that more often than not, mid-pricers fail rather than succeed, there have been some mid-priced picks in the past that have gone on to be extremely successful (David Swallow in 2014 is a notable one), so I don't completely write off selecting mid-pricers myself, however, know that there is a risk involved with selecting them and be prepared to cut your losses early if they don't pay off. I selected Sam Gray at the start of last year, who turned out to be a massive fail, so rather than keeping the faith I traded him out in round 5 for the ever-reliable Joel Selwood and never looked back. There is not much worse than holding onto a mid-pricer who is under-performing in hope that they will improve their output, only to be stuck with them for the remainder of the season as they've lost a considerable amount of value and it's not worth trading them (anyone who had Lumumba in 2015 will attest to this).

I think this guy is one to compare with considering the similar finishing point we had

I've played SC for a few years now and before last season I had always had decent years - nothing special, just solid (i.e. finishing above 6000 but never cracking the top 1000 mark). The main thing that elevated me to the 'next level' (so to speak) was thinking outside the box. Not too far outside, but just enough as to not crash and burn. Let me explain my thinking last year:

Firstly, I looked back to previous years and tried to answer a few questions. 1) Where did I go wrong? 2) What information was I using and who was the information from? 3) How much did I trust my own calls? and 4) What areas (no matter how small) did I not try and take advantage of?

This helped BIG TIME.

A few things popped out at me:

Previously:

1) I'd never really nailed my starting rookies: I'd probably gone about 50/50 in this area and noted that there had to be a better way to select these cash cows.
2) I probably listened to others too much: now don't get me wrong. Information is key in this game. If you don't research you set yourself up for failure and the amount of luck you require increases ten fold. For me I realised I'd been making decisions based too much on what others thought. I had to trust my gut more.
3) There had to be ways to try and get a small advantage that had not been tried yet: I had to make an effort this year to think a little out of the box and come up with something new (e.g. the Cloke-manoeuvre successfully implemented by Dimmawits)
4) Did I plan for the bye rounds too much?: had planning for the bye rounds negatively impacted my team through the year? Possibly.

Season 2016:

I decided to address all of the points above by implementing the following:

1) Using rookie information and data (provided by Ken (KLo30) - thanks again mate), I came up with a Rookie Rating spreadsheet that ranked all rookies that played during the NAB Series (which I also shared on SCS) based on stats such as game time, DT:SC ratio, K:H ratio, etc. and made a final list of all the rookies I wanted in my side. I then added in all those that fit my structure for (hopefully) the best outcome. It wasn't an exact science, but it worked out this time

2) When it came to selecting premos, I used a careful mixture of info, data and most importantly - my gut. I made sure that, to make the cut for my starting squad, I wanted premos (ideally) that were 1) durable (would most likely play at least 20 games), 2) proven scorers and 3) provided flexibility between lines (however this criterion was quite fluid). Where I wasn't too sure one a certain player - and there were 2-3 in the end. I just went with my gut with a plan to rectify and problems early on (e.g. initially selecting Tom Rockliff).

3) To try and gain that small advantage, I found myself looking into the option of picking a (term I coined) Floating Doughnut To Play (FDTP). This was just simply looking at rookies outside my initial selection list and seeing if there were any that may be selected 5-8 rounds (or so) into the season. For 2016 that was Petracca. It helped that I had a decent idea that he would be blooded relatively early - although how early was the risk. So in selecting him I got a rookie who 1) was going to get game time (pretty good JS), 2) added flexibility through DPP and 3) was another FD option while he was out. So all in all I went into 2016 with THREE FD'S (Ueber FWD, Petracca MID and Wyatt RUC)! And it worked an absolute treat! A risk that paid off and gave me a minor step up on some of the comp in the early rounds. It was also nice not having to worry about culling a rookie to bring him in - a bit of a belated present if you will.

4) For the bye rounds, I wanted to be consistent with limited fluctuation over the 3 weeks. No real special scores; consistency was key. So in planning, they were in the back of my mind, but my structure was flexible enough to allow for them while not being tied to them. That flexibility allowed for any unforeseen circumstances (e.g. Tippett and Dahlhaus going out in the SAME WEEK comes to mind! - got through that one with flying colours)

5) Finally - midpricers! There is no doubt a sweet spot in knowing when they're going to go well and when to cull. For me it was Lonergan. He was my highest risk selection. I gave him enough time to pump out some 90s and some 30s, but when the time came I did end up culling him (he made me a little cash - not much) but in a way that allowed me to stick to my structure and plan - always have a plan at least a few weeks ahead! Don't compromise unless you have no other choice.

In saying all that - I did make some mistakes - as you always do. For example I started with Hall, traded him out when he got injured, traded him back in (for some strange reason - maybe for Barlow?) and then ultimately traded him out again! That was probably my worst one, but I managed to cover it well

So all in all: trust yourself, do your research and try a few small things that differentiate you from the pack. With a bit of luck, you may end up improving as much as I (and jmack5) did

Happy SCing!

 

[Bomber18]

I think this guy is one to compare with considering the similar finishing point we had

I've played SC for a few years now and before last season I had always had decent years - nothing special, just solid (i.e. finishing above 6000 but never cracking the top 1000 mark). The main thing that elevated me to the 'next level' (so to speak) was thinking outside the box. Not too far outside, but just enough as to not crash and burn. Let me explain my thinking last year:

Firstly, I looked back to previous years and tried to answer a few questions. 1) Where did I go wrong? 2) What information was I using and who was the information from? 3) How much did I trust my own calls? and 4) What areas (no matter how small) did I not try and take advantage of?

This helped BIG TIME.

A few things popped out at me:

Previously:

1) I'd never really nailed my starting rookies: I'd probably gone about 50/50 in this area and noted that there had to be a better way to select these cash cows.
2) I probably listened to others too much: now don't get me wrong. Information is key in this game. If you don't research you set yourself up for failure and the amount of luck you require increases ten fold. For me I realised I'd been making decisions based too much on what others thought. I had to trust my gut more.
3) There had to be ways to try and get a small advantage that had not been tried yet: I had to make an effort this year to think a little out of the box and come up with something new (e.g. the Cloke-manoeuvre successfully implemented by Dimmawits)
4) Did I plan for the bye rounds too much?: had planning for the bye rounds negatively impacted my team through the year? Possibly.

Season 2016:

I decided to address all of the points above by implementing the following:

1) Using rookie information and data (provided by Ken (KLo30) - thanks again mate), I came up with a Rookie Rating spreadsheet that ranked all rookies that played during the NAB Series (which I also shared on SCS) based on stats such as game time, DT:SC ratio, K:H ratio, etc. and made a final list of all the rookies I wanted in my side. I then added in all those that fit my structure for (hopefully) the best outcome. It wasn't an exact science, but it worked out this time

2) When it came to selecting premos, I used a careful mixture of info, data and most importantly - my gut. I made sure that, to make the cut for my starting squad, I wanted premos (ideally) that were 1) durable (would most likely play at least 20 games), 2) proven scorers and 3) provided flexibility between lines (however this criterion was quite fluid). Where I wasn't too sure one a certain player - and there were 2-3 in the end. I just went with my gut with a plan to rectify and problems early on (e.g. initially selecting Tom Rockliff).

3) To try and gain that small advantage, I found myself looking into the option of picking a (term I coined) Floating Doughnut To Play (FDTP). This was just simply looking at rookies outside my initial selection list and seeing if there were any that may be selected 5-8 rounds (or so) into the season. For 2016 that was Petracca. It helped that I had a decent idea that he would be blooded relatively early - although how early was the risk. So in selecting him I got a rookie who 1) was going to get game time (pretty good JS), 2) added flexibility through DPP and 3) was another FD option while he was out. So all in all I went into 2016 with THREE FD'S (Ueber FWD, Petracca MID and Wyatt RUC)! And it worked an absolute treat! A risk that paid off and gave me a minor step up on some of the comp in the early rounds. It was also nice not having to worry about culling a rookie to bring him in - a bit of a belated present if you will.

4) For the bye rounds, I wanted to be consistent with limited fluctuation over the 3 weeks. No real special scores; consistency was key. So in planning, they were in the back of my mind, but my structure was flexible enough to allow for them while not being tied to them. That flexibility allowed for any unforeseen circumstances (e.g. Tippett and Dahlhaus going out in the SAME WEEK comes to mind! - got through that one with flying colours)

5) Finally - midpricers! There is no doubt a sweet spot in knowing when they're going to go well and when to cull. For me it was Lonergan. He was my highest risk selection. I gave him enough time to pump out some 90s and some 30s, but when the time came I did end up culling him (he made me a little cash - not much) but in a way that allowed me to stick to my structure and plan - always have a plan at least a few weeks ahead! Don't compromise unless you have no other choice.

In saying all that - I did make some mistakes - as you always do. For example I started with Hall, traded him out when he got injured, traded him back in (for some strange reason - maybe for Barlow?) and then ultimately traded him out again! That was probably my worst one, but I managed to cover it well

So all in all: trust yourself, do your research and try a few small things that differentiate you from the pack. With a bit of luck, you may end up improving as much as I (and jmack5) did

Happy SCing!

Fantastic insight mate. Agree with you with nailing the rookies. You did some fantastic work last season compiling that spreadsheet and it clearly helped you nail those rookies. It no doubt helps when you nail a few of the must-haves like Papley, Kennedy & to a lesser extent Parish last season. I missed all three at the start and I paid the price early.

I trust you'll compile another rookie cheat sheet this season!

 

[t.thomas6]

Fantastic insight mate. Agree with you with nailing the rookies. You did some fantastic work last season compiling that spreadsheet and it clearly helped you nail those rookies. It no doubt helps when you nail a few of the must-haves like Papley, Kennedy & to a lesser extent Parish last season. I missed all three at the start and I paid the price early.

I trust you'll compile another rookie cheat sheet this season!

Thanks mate

Hopefully if I get some time I definitely will - if Ken can help out with the stats again?

 

[Courtesans]

The above information is terrific, but should be tempered with what your goal is.
I would guess most of us want to win the big one, our leagues, finish as high as possible.
My goal in 2016 was top 1,000, did it. I was v. pleased. Got a medal from the boss, means a lot for all of us here.
This year it is top 500, means a bit more work.
Leagues, particularly SCS ones are tough, I fell at the 2nd last hurdle in a number of leagues last year, but have an aim, don't be frivolous.
It is all about making money, the rookies. This is how you succeed.

 

[IDIG]

Giving this a bump as it's probably one of my favourite threads on SCS and one i'd hate to have slipped through the cracks, especially for our newer members who wouldn't have seen it.

I know every year is different but the fundamentals remain the same and if you're wanting to get yourself into that elite SC-ing bracket taking note of what's been said in this thread will go a long way to achieving that goal.

I've added a poll and a bit of a 2017 goal theme to keep this thread bumped. So hopefully we can get some more high finishers to add their thoughts before the year starts as well.

For me, my goal is to make it into the top 1000 every year. I don't feel especially confident with my team this year so still waiting for something to click.

 

[manyproblems]

Last year I picked Rich, Lonergan, Crouch x2 and Libba.

I wake up every morning, take a deep breath, stare into the mirror, and I say

I will not pick Steele
I will not pick JOM
I will not pick Swallow
I will not pick Steele
I will not pick Nankervis maybe
I will not pick Tuohy
I will not pick Steele
I will not pick Roughead
I will not pick Steele

This year I am going to pick the safest team ever, in hope I can keep my trades and be aggressive with every rookie that presents.

 

[Darkie]

Bump ... well worth a read as we finalise our sides.

 

[Ricky Bobby]

Aiming to get back in the Top 1000 and finish the year strongly in Leagues
I want my final team to be full of high quality players that I actually want in my team and not a whole lot of second rate duds who I brought in because I couldn't afford the top shelf.
Money making rookies, some smart trading and a bit of luck with injuries will be required....

 

[Courtesans]

Top 1,000. Gez, you need some luck to achieve that, regardless how good you maybe at this.

 

[Brettthejett]

I've found that in my good season (297) that u have to start well to be anywhere near the front. One good week early is all it takes I remember ranking 35th one week and that shot me right up the ranking and was in the top 1000 for most of the season, rewind to last season 5 horror weeks rd3-7 and I was done barely managing to scrape to 1900 most weeks. I wish there was a way that I could see what I did back then and apply that to this year coz I'd feel a whole lot more confident than I do now

 

[Tamuhawk]

I've found that in my good season (297) that u have to start well to be anywhere near the front. One good week early is all it takes I remember ranking 35th one week and that shot me right up the ranking and was in the top 1000 for most of the season, rewind to last season 5 horror weeks rd3-7 and I was done barely managing to scrape to 1900 most weeks. I wish there was a way that I could see what I did back then and apply that to this year coz I'd feel a whole lot more confident than I do now

My friend was rank 11th in round one of last year and said that it was enough to keep him in the top 1000 for the rest of the year. So it's probably true.

 

[Pearcey47]

In 2015 I was ranked 85,192nd after round 1 and ranked 10th after round 14 so not always the way but certainly thinks it helps getting off to a good start.

 

[Bomber18]

In 2015 I was ranked 85,192nd after round 1 and ranked 10th after round 14 so not always the way but certainly thinks it helps getting off to a good start.

Just wow. That's a crazy recovery!

 

[Pearcey47]

Just wow. That's a crazy recovery!

I was in the top 3000 after round 4 but it sounded more dramatic that way!