Position SC 2021: Defender Discussion

[Herbie66]

I have Wehr a tier below the options I mentioned for a few reasons:
1) I don't know how good defensively he is. Shaw and Williams were both pretty good and those are the spots that need filling, unless Ash steps his game up.
2) It sounds like Whitfield will be back sooner rather than later, which limits Wehr's options.
3) Historically Leon and mates are very adverse to rookies with the occasional exception. See Green going in and out last year, Ash not getting a gig until a few weeks in, games given to players like Reid or Mumford or Jacobs when they were basically done, not to mention the constant cycling through of first round midfielders after their two year stopover.

I think they'll stick with Finlayson as the backup ruck. He's played down back before and he's way too adverse to contact. At least up forward he can expose match-ups and he's looked ok against other backup rucks with his athleticism.

Buntine was flagged as a KPD-type role on the medium forwards out there. Personally I think he's past it because of his injuries, they've really stripped him back to a very vanilla player who can get exposed (and often thinks his foot skills are where they used to be). So he'd be up against the Idun/Keeffe position.

Unfortunately for SC people they (we) live in a different world to Leon and his inner sanctum and expect him to automatically play all the kids , even though he has repeatedly said publically they need to learn the Giants way and earn their spots.

Shouldn't let AFL reality get in the way of SC though 😉

Been too long for me to remember what sort of player Buntine used to be.

Great insights

 

[Johno9911]

Forgive me if it has been discussed earlier - anyone have any thoughts on Dawson? 2020 seemed to be a tale of two halves for him, went at 74 for the first nine games (12 points down on his 2019 avg) and ran out the last 7 games at 99.4. If you think he keeps up the 99, starting him at the 85 he is priced at could be a nice win and a POD with him sitting in 0% of teams atm.

The question probably needs to go to Swans fan/observers. Was there a change in role for him? His avg disposals didn't seem to spike - 15.2 in the first nine compared to 17.5 in the last 7 (certainly not enough to justify a 25 point increase). I do note he kicked 5 goals in the latter half of the season compared to 1 in the first, was he maybe playing more of MID/HFF role? Would love some thoughts or suggestions on how you think he will go in 2021.

 

[Under The Dome]

Forgive me if it has been discussed earlier - anyone have any thoughts on Dawson? 2020 seemed to be a tale of two halves for him, went at 74 for the first nine games (12 points down on his 2019 avg) and ran out the last 7 games at 99.4. If you think he keeps up the 99, starting him at the 85 he is priced at could be a nice win and a POD with him sitting in 0% of teams atm.

The question probably needs to go to Swans fan/observers. Was there a change in role for him? His avg disposals didn't seem to spike - 15.2 in the first nine compared to 17.5 in the last 7 (certainly not enough to justify a 25 point increase). I do note he kicked 5 goals in the latter half of the season compared to 1 in the first, was he maybe playing more of MID/HFF role? Would love some thoughts or suggestions on how you think he will go in 2021.

He has actually done the back half of the season well in the last 2 seasons. Went at 94.4 in the last 9 in 2019 aswell. Would like to find out more about his role for the back half of those two seasons myself. Horse probably experiments with him in the first half of the season and it hasn't worked so could well be settling into that one role better than others.

 

[Herbie66]

Laird , Sholl , Milera , Hamill , McAsey , Butts that could be a interesting starting Back 6

EDIT Worrell even more so especially if Chugg & Laurie appear as well.

 

[Under The Dome]

Laird , Sholl , Milera , Hamill , McAsey , Butts that could be a interesting starting Back 6

Forgetting the best one McPherson

 

[Herbie66]

Forgetting the best one McPherson

Damn I hit delete instead of edit

Actually liked Hamill a lot more last season , at least 2 maybe even 3 concussion affected games.

Problem is they have too many for that W/HB role

Hamill , McPherson , Milera , Seedsman , Sholl , Smith (1 misses out , maybe even 2 if Lynch plays wing)

 

[Connoisseur]

Damn I hit delete instead of edit

You should be able to edit the post now.

 

[Herbie66]

You should be able to edit the post now.

Cheers big 👂's 😀

 

[Under The Dome]

Damn I hit delete instead of edit

Actually liked Hamill a lot more last season , at least 2 maybe even 3 concussion affected games.

Problem is they have too many for that W/HB role

Hamill , McPherson , Milera , Seedsman , Sholl , Smith (1 misses out , maybe even 2 if Lynch plays wing)

Read somewhere that Milera had been training in the midfield this year. That may open up a spot down there.

 

[Herbie66]

Read somewhere that Milera had been training in the midfield this year. That may open up a spot down there.

They are all training in the midfield though apart from the KPP

Rotation A - Crouch , Laird , Sloane
Rotation B - Hately , Schoenberg , Sholl

Keays run with role

So I expect guys like Jones , Milera , Seedsman , Smith etc will be rotation C & D

 

[wogitalia]

Forgive me if it has been discussed earlier - anyone have any thoughts on Dawson? 2020 seemed to be a tale of two halves for him, went at 74 for the first nine games (12 points down on his 2019 avg) and ran out the last 7 games at 99.4. If you think he keeps up the 99, starting him at the 85 he is priced at could be a nice win and a POD with him sitting in 0% of teams atm.

The question probably needs to go to Swans fan/observers. Was there a change in role for him? His avg disposals didn't seem to spike - 15.2 in the first nine compared to 17.5 in the last 7 (certainly not enough to justify a 25 point increase). I do note he kicked 5 goals in the latter half of the season compared to 1 in the first, was he maybe playing more of MID/HFF role? Would love some thoughts or suggestions on how you think he will go in 2021.

Ironically it's a bit of the opposite to what you've read from the stats. He started in defense and was alright before moving forward, almost to a KP role at times which he struggled with, like a lot of bigger midfielder types when you put an elite mid sized defender on them all of a sudden their "strong marking" doesn't look so good and he really struggled with it.

Moved back into a HB/Defensive wing type role for the last part of the season and actually kicked more goals in that role than as a forward (massive leg on him and pushes high). Didn't hurt that the team played a lot better and he's a very outside type of player so that helps immensely.

The biggest statistical change is going from 2.75 to 4.75 marks and that 2.75 drops to 2 after the first 3 rounds also spent in defense, bigger than just the marks is that they're also intercept marks quite frequently, he's very adept at floating in from the side for strong marks when playing behind.

He's one I'm watching very closely, think he's a solid 95 defender in that intercept role and IF Mills moves to the midfield he's by far the most logical choice to fill that hole, imo. He's a great kick and a strong mark, bit iffy one on one but that's what the other defenders are for.

If Mills doesn't go midfield I expect he keeps getting lost between positions mostly but he's probably the starting wing opposite Blakey right now if not and really he should be better in that role. Just one of the many players who looks way more comfortable behind the play reading rather than ahead dictating.

Edit: the previous season followed a similar trend of him finding a position and then playing well.

 

[Goodie's Guns]

They are all training in the midfield though apart from the KPP

Rotation A - Crouch , Laird , Sloane
Rotation B - Hately , Schoenberg , Sholl

Keays run with role

So I expect guys like Jones , Milera , Seedsman , Smith etc will be rotation C & D

Surely Sholl isn't going into that inside mid rotation? When they say midfield, surely they are talking wing and maybe the extra at a stoppage to release on the outside. Hard to see the Crows throwing all three of Hately, Schoenberg and Sholl in all together at any one time as well, expect Keays hardened frame to be in there to protect the lighter frame of Shoenberg and Sholl.

 

[Herbie66]

Surely Sholl isn't going into that inside mid rotation? When they say midfield, surely they are talking wing and maybe the extra at a stoppage to release on the outside. Hard to see the Crows throwing all three of Hately, Schoenberg and Sholl in all together at any one time as well, expect Keays hardened frame to be in there to protect the lighter frame of Shoenberg and Sholl.

It's the problem with how people define midfield these days as well.

I classify wingers as midfielders.

Mind you when you essentially have 15 players per side following the ball around in an area of 30-40 metres everyone is a mid.

It's only at CB when anyone is even closely playing a position.

Late last season the majority of the time it was Crouch , Crouch , Laird , Sloane with Keays running off a wing.

My guess would be Crouch & Laird at the source 80% of the time , get ball , feed ball out to Hately , Milera , Seedsman , Sholl etc and let them use their run and kicking skills.

Problem then is allowing them that initial space to utilise.

Time ROB used that big body of his as a battering ram.

That Sholl kid has one of the best kicks I have seen in years.

Milera still could be anything at all if he could get his body right , obviously won't ever be as good , but he has hints of McLeod in him at times.

 

[Diabolical]

Surely Sholl isn't going into that inside mid rotation? When they say midfield, surely they are talking wing and maybe the extra at a stoppage to release on the outside. Hard to see the Crows throwing all three of Hately, Schoenberg and Sholl in all together at any one time as well, expect Keays hardened frame to be in there to protect the lighter frame of Shoenberg and Sholl.

In that case, if I had him in a keeper league I would try and offload him cheaply then

 

[Goodie's Guns]

In that case, if I had him in a keeper league I would try and offload him cheaply then

Did his best scoring on the wing last year utilising his run and carry and elite foot skills.

The kid is going to be a serious player! 2 x 1sts minimum

 

[Goodie's Guns]

https://twitter.com/i/web/status/1362692024407789568

 

[gutsroy]

Seems (sadly) to bode well for Lloyd:

https://twitter.com/i/web/status/1362586507534475265

 

[manyproblems]

It's been mentioned before but Docherty in only 6.7% of teams is staggering to me.

At 496k and knowing what he is capable of, he has been locked into my side since day 1. I get that he scored poorly for a stretch of games last year, Saad is now at the club and the Blues might play more attacking, but he just seems like a super safe pick as I can't see the club not wanting to continue to use him coming out of the backline.

Averaged 97.6 excluding the injury game last year with only 4 scores under 80, coming off 2 years out of the game!

Off 2 ACLs, followed by soreness for a lot of the year where his scoring dipped, then pinged a calf, plus surgeries this off season and the unknown of how he score with Saad and Newman back in the team make him difficult to lock in.

However he'll probably have a lot better preseason this than year than last, and hub life would be difficult to prepare for someone especially coming off an ACL.

 

[Beg2Differ]

Seems (sadly) to bode well for Lloyd:

https://twitter.com/i/web/status/1362586507534475265

...and long may it continue.

Only 2 types of Supercoaches really; those that own Sir Jake, and those that wish they did.

 

[gutsroy]

...and long may it continue.

Only 2 types of Supercoaches really; those that own Sir Jake, and those that wish they did.

Have to agree to disagree there 😂
Jake Lloyd stands for everything that is wrong in our country.
He's the embodiment of the moral turpitude of a society in decay, a society which applauds cheap stats over substance, chip-scabbing over hardball gets, pack-skirting over winning your own footy.
Thank you for listening to my TED Talk.