Position Rucks Discussion

Which ruckmen will you be starting (new poll 4/3/19)

  • Grundy $708

    Votes: 100 69.4%
  • Gawn $692

    Votes: 96 66.7%
  • Martin $574

    Votes: 3 2.1%
  • Westhoff $550

    Votes: 9 6.3%
  • Goldstein $548

    Votes: 48 33.3%
  • Nankervis $533

    Votes: 4 2.8%
  • Witts $481

    Votes: 7 4.9%
  • Lycett $441

    Votes: 3 2.1%
  • Kreuzer $433k

    Votes: 2 1.4%
  • Smith $173k / Clarke $143k

    Votes: 18 12.5%

  • Total voters
    144

Hondo

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I don’t know that I agree, I think if you were to pick two alternatives that go well and then invest the spare cash into quality on the other lines it could win it for you this year. That’s assuming Gawn and Grundy to tits up of course which is a very big if. High risk, but high reward (especially if you get your other selections right).
Oh yeah but that's the other side of the risk reward. If you pick neither, they flop and you pick the right alternatives yes you are a good chance to win it, like any major POD position you take.

But that's different from having your season sunk if you have them and they flop, unless you meant anything other than $50K is a sunk season.

There's a problem most have and then there's a problem your POD position has.
 

Zagbag

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Sorry, broad generalisation

Should have just said most “serious” teams.

Some serious very decent teams could have neither like yours :)

Point being having one or both will be a popular set up so if it goes south it affects most teams
Just poking fun. I'm trying to recreate the glory days of SandiWitts at all costs.
 

Hondo

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Just poking fun. I'm trying to recreate the glory days of SandiWitts at all costs.
I was on SandiWitts that year. It was a POD setup and it worked really well versus Gawn.

I haven't been able to find SandiWitts equivalents this time around. Witts was that number one ruck, entering ruck maturity etc .. a gift from the SC gods that a lot didn't want to risk.
 
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might just go Gawn , Mummy , English and at least have the option to see if Mumford can go 90-95+ , if English plays might provide cover as well.

Goldstein + Bines = $ 650,400.00

Mumford + English = $ 630,800.00

looked at Goldstein at R2 , toyed with starting Jacobs & Lycett but might get stuck around 80-85.

Think I need at least one of Gawn & Grundy as a minimum.

Hopefully English & Mumford make some $$$ then will be a one down , one up.

Preferred if Smith , Clarke , Fort is named Rd 1 & 2 but no guarantees.
 

Leroy

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The word on Kreuzer is that he's "aiming" for R1, whatever that means.
Anybody shed some light on where he's at?

Andrew Phillips scored 81 and 62 (against Grundy and with only 4 disposals!) in JLT, which I'd take from a $278k R2.
Figure that as soon as Kreuzer is fit he gets moved aside however.
 

TerryB

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I was curious what effect the new rules may have on the scoring of the rucks.
In the full 2018 AFL season, including finals, there was a total of 16,098 ruck hit-outs in 207 games.
An average of 77.77 hit-outs per game.
Compare this with the 2019 JLT series. I believe these games were played for the full game time with time-on.
Round 1 of the 2019 JLT series: there were 664 hit-outs, an average of 73.77.
Round 2 of the 2019 JLT series: there were 647 hit-outs, an average of 71.88.
The 2 round 2019 JLT total is 1,311 tap-outs at an average of 72.83 hit-outs per game.
Info from: https://supercoachscores.com/threads/jlt-game-summaries.4029/
The difference, on this small sample of the full 2018 AFL season, versus the 2019 JLT series, indicates a decrease of 4.94 hit-outs per game.
This represents a 6.35% decrease in hit-outs and ruck scoring.
Maybe some of you more experienced super-coach players can make and share some worthwhile conclusions?

Info used 2018 from "footywire", https://www.footywire.com/afl/footy/ft_ladder?year=2018&pt=ST&st=hitouts&sb=g :
Adelaide, 903 hit-outs in 22 games
Carlton, 722 hit-outs in 22 games
Essendon, 822 hit-outs in 22 games
Bulldogs, 612 hit-outs in 22 games
Freo, 910 hit-outs in 22 games
Kangaroos, 915 hit-outs in 22 games
Brisbane, 949 hit-outs in 22 games
Port Adelaide, 895 hit-outs in 22 games
Saints, 647 hit-outs in 22 games
Gold Coast, 998 hit-outs in 22 games
Geelong, 824 hit-outs in 23 games
Sydney, 736 hit-outs in 23 games
GWS, 862 hit-outs in 24 games
Hawthorn, 984 hit-outs in 24 games
Richmond, 671 hit-outs in 24 games
Melbourne, 1,263 hit-outs in 25 games
WCE, 1,124 hit-outs in 25 games
Collingwood, 1,211 hit-outs in 26 games
 

Bomber18

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I was curious what effect the new rules may have on the scoring of the rucks.
In the full 2018 AFL season, including finals, there was a total of 16,098 ruck hit-outs in 207 games.
An average of 77.77 hit-outs per game.
Compare this with the 2019 JLT series. I believe these games were played for the full game time with time-on.
Round 1 of the 2019 JLT series: there were 664 hit-outs, an average of 73.77.
Round 2 of the 2019 JLT series: there were 647 hit-outs, an average of 71.88.
The 2 round 2019 JLT total is 1,311 tap-outs at an average of 72.83 hit-outs per game.
Info from: https://supercoachscores.com/threads/jlt-game-summaries.4029/
The difference, on this small sample of the full 2018 AFL season, versus the 2019 JLT series, indicates a decrease of 4.94 hit-outs per game.
This represents a 6.35% decrease in hit-outs and ruck scoring.
Maybe some of you more experienced super-coach players can make and share some worthwhile conclusions?

Info used 2018 from "footywire", https://www.footywire.com/afl/footy/ft_ladder?year=2018&pt=ST&st=hitouts&sb=g :
Adelaide, 903 hit-outs in 22 games
Carlton, 722 hit-outs in 22 games
Essendon, 822 hit-outs in 22 games
Bulldogs, 612 hit-outs in 22 games
Freo, 910 hit-outs in 22 games
Kangaroos, 915 hit-outs in 22 games
Brisbane, 949 hit-outs in 22 games
Port Adelaide, 895 hit-outs in 22 games
Saints, 647 hit-outs in 22 games
Gold Coast, 998 hit-outs in 22 games
Geelong, 824 hit-outs in 23 games
Sydney, 736 hit-outs in 23 games
GWS, 862 hit-outs in 24 games
Hawthorn, 984 hit-outs in 24 games
Richmond, 671 hit-outs in 24 games
Melbourne, 1,263 hit-outs in 25 games
WCE, 1,124 hit-outs in 25 games
Collingwood, 1,211 hit-outs in 26 games
Interesting stats but I think also the tackles would be down in the JLT as teams would tend to play a bit more bruise free, leading to less stoppages. It might be also interesting to compare the 2018 JLT stats with the 2018 figures (prior to 6-6-6). Theoretically, 6-6-6 would lead to more goals and more CBs as well, so the very good ruckman would be able to benefit from more HTAs.

Hard to really know if rucks will struggle as a result of 6-6-6 or not.
 

TerryB

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Interesting stats but I think also the tackles would be down in the JLT as teams would tend to play a bit more bruise free, leading to less stoppages. It might be also interesting to compare the 2018 JLT stats with the 2018 figures (prior to 6-6-6). Theoretically, 6-6-6 would lead to more goals and more CBs as well, so the very good ruckman would be able to benefit from more HTAs.

Hard to really know if rucks will struggle as a result of 6-6-6 or not.
Yes, agree with you Bomber18, I am sure there will be more factors to consider than only the hit-outs. It will be interesting to watch this unfold :)
 
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@Connoisseur

should be finalising my NRL side and doing IPL research but can't help myself 😁

Do you have Jacobs H & A averages and for Home wins and losses please ?

Cheers
 

Connoisseur

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@Connoisseur

should be finalising my NRL side and doing IPL research but can't help myself 😁

Do you have Jacobs H & A averages and for Home wins and losses please ?

Cheers
S Jacobs (95+ avg seasons)
AO: 107.6 from 35 (12/35 below 100, 14/35 120+)
2014: 115.5 from 12
2015: 104.27 from 11
2017: 102.75 from 12

AO Wins: 111 from 23 (7/23 below 100, 10/23 120+)
2014: 118.67 from 6
2015: 117.63 from 8
2017: 100 from 9

2018 AO: 84.42 from 12
2018 AO Wins: 92.25 from 8

Wouldn't bother with S Jacobs as nowadays he doesn't record sufficient work around the ground (eg disposals and marks).
 
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S Jacobs (95+ avg seasons)
AO: 107.6 from 35 (12/35 below 100, 14/35 120+)
2014: 115.5 from 12
2015: 104.27 from 11
2017: 102.75 from 12

AO Wins: 111 from 23 (7/23 below 100, 10/23 120+)
2014: 118.67 from 6
2015: 117.63 from 8
2017: 100 from 9

2018 AO: 84.42 from 12
2018 AO Wins: 92.25 from 8

Wouldn't bother with S Jacobs as nowadays he doesn't record sufficient work around the ground (eg disposals and marks).
Thanks for that , but Sauce is fit , the Crouch boys are back , they will make the finals , Jones is better than Roo , oops been listening to the media too much

You are spot on though he doesn't seem to link up in the disposal chain anymore.

Back to the drawing board.
 

BigRuss

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you just have to work down the list and consider everyone 😀

maybe English & Mummy or back to Goldy & Bines.

who are you running with ?
Gawn & Goldy at the minute for me mate, Grundy went too high last year and the odds are very much stacked against him IMO. The money saved lets me run Moore over a rookie with a bit of cushion for corrections, looks well worth it to me. Removing Sandi from Goldys fixture makes it a pretty good run early.
 

BlueNwhiteHoops

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S Jacobs (95+ avg seasons)
AO: 107.6 from 35 (12/35 below 100, 14/35 120+)
2014: 115.5 from 12
2015: 104.27 from 11
2017: 102.75 from 12

AO Wins: 111 from 23 (7/23 below 100, 10/23 120+)
2014: 118.67 from 6
2015: 117.63 from 8
2017: 100 from 9

2018 AO: 84.42 from 12
2018 AO Wins: 92.25 from 8

Wouldn't bother with S Jacobs as nowadays he doesn't record sufficient work around the ground (eg disposals and marks).
So there's like no chance he could score at 95-100 over the first 8 rounds in your opinion? I was thinking a fit midfield plus more wins from an easy draw might make him a possible fill-in until Gawn/Grundy drop.
 

Connoisseur

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So there's like no chance he could score at 95-100 over the first 8 rounds in your opinion? I was thinking a fit midfield plus more wins from an easy draw might make him a possible fill-in until Gawn/Grundy drop.
Potentially but it depends how risk-averse you are and the probability he'll average sufficient to earn cash to lessen the differential between Grundy and Gawn would be quite low as over the past 3 seasons he's lacked the ability to score 100+ or 120+.

S Jacobs since 2016:
Played 64 of a possible 66 matches matches for an average of 88.89.
17/64 100+ or 26.56%
8/64 120+ or 12.5%
 
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Gawn & Goldy at the minute for me mate, Grundy went too high last year and the odds are very much stacked against him IMO. The money saved lets me run Moore over a rookie with a bit of cushion for corrections, looks well worth it to me. Removing Sandi from Goldys fixture makes it a pretty good run early.
That looks the preferred option at the moment.

Have Moore at F5.

Might need to keep more $$$ in the bank in case the rookies go pear shaped after 2 rounds , challenging times.
 

McLovin

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I'd given in and picked Gawn and Grundy but it just feels a bit defeatist to me, it's very hard to expect one of them to go close to justifying their starting price- let alone both. Playing as a lone ruck is very hard on the body, making backing up after a dominant season extremely difficult/nigh on impossible.

My thinking at the moment is that I may as pick one well use Westhoff as a placeholder in the hope that he'll be a top 10 forward in the end. None of the cheap ruck options are at all realistic to me.
Pierce- no certainty and isn't worth picking as he probably won't be able to keep out Long (who is genuinely terrible)
Mumford- suspension isn't ideal plus he's an injury prone 32 year old who I doubt will play every week
English- a beanpole who'll share ruck time and will need to be managed if the bulldogs don't want to ruin him physically by letting bigger ruckmen beat him up every week
Darcy- not sure how long he'll get as first ruck, his style of ruck is also a bit out of place in the modern game (see Preuss). Mumford took a long time to build up to what he became and these guys won't be any different should they succeed
The rest- won't play early unless someone goes down injured

I don't see much upside in Goldstein, Martin and the rest of the sub 600k options either. Westhoff is unlikely to average 100 again and his only other recent acceptable season was in 2015 when he averaged 94.7, so he screams spike year too. Ugh, there really aren't any simple options this year aside from hoping that Gawn and Grundy can both defy history.
 
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