Discussion The Round 0 Knee Jerk

[Vicwood]

View attachment 69073

With Reid in the mids - seems excessive I must admit, still debating about Fyfe & Jordon tbh

I think you really need to start Sexton on field. Its gets depressing when you see a 100 points on the bench.

 

[Shannon]

I think you really need to start Sexton on field. Its gets depressing when you see a 100 points on the bench.

Agree - I have moved things around, he’s on the field now 👍

 

[FlatTrackBully]

After last night's games.

Sexton stays and will be an on ground rookie. My only Suns player. Touk touk looks good and will be an upgrade target.
Gibcus stays and looks ok as a back line on field rook. Wait and see on Naismith, but looks fine if he does play. Like the look of Shorts role, might be worth looking at after his bye.
Not sold on Wehr, might become Roberts or someone cheaper. Himmelberg stays, as does Cadman, though Cadman not on the field unless things are dire.
Green a definite upgrade target, might win the brownlow the way he looks.
Just the one Collingwood player in Daicos, and he isn't leaving my side unless a tsunami wipes out Victoria Park , so long as he's fit.

Touk is the cheapest he will be all year, might as well eat the bye and start him now rather than trying to get him when he's potentially put on another 50k.

Roberts is close to a must have imo, had majority of kick ins and Sydney genuinely want him in that back 6 by moving Lloyd to the wing.

 

[quite ironic]

Yeah you make some good points and I have huge respect for your opinion on this forum so it’s concerning finding myself in opposition but I feel like there is an hint of rose coloured glasses (which probably o***et my opposite tinged glasses) around how well he works out.

My main issue is, I just can’t see where this sudden change comes from. Last year he was clearly fringe with Robertson preferred, who could be back as soon as this week and if not I’d strongly expect him in round 3. So there is absolutely no reason to think Lyons’ JS has suddenly become rock solid, and very good reason to think it’s suspect. I’m also pretty sure his best issue wasn’t limited to being the sub as he actually started and was subbed off in a couple of games. So even being named this week is a risk - if Coleman hadn’t been injured he may well have been the sub vs Carlton. Purely hypothetical, but the body of evidence across last year supports him being fringe/sub risk much more than him returning to a line midfield role.

I definitely agree that getting him in could be tricky, but I don’t think that alone is a reason to start him. We can’t crystal ball those trades, but the pathway to him could be much easier than it seems. But starting a risky pick to avoid the need for a correction trade seems crazy - if he is a risk he’s a risk, and if he’s not he’s not. If he becomes a must get, then so be it. But you only get 1 score for a guy locked in your team before the price rise, and who knows.. you might have more problems in round 3 which means you have to carry him even if getting subbed. Plus if you start a guy in that midfield spot with no bye who scores 70 both weeks, they will comfortably outscore him off his 1 round 2 score.

FWIW I think he could be amazing, but in the absence of clear information around why things are suddenly different and the evidence last year that showed his position, I think it’s prudent to see how it develops.

One thing I will say though is it does depend on the make up of your side and overall risk profile. For example having Lyons and Fyfe feels extremely risky given the compounding nature of things, but only one should be manageable.

The thing with Robertson is he was really only selected over Lyons in rounds 18-22 when Ashcroft was out.

Robertson got to play midfield in those games and was objectively terrible so I don’t think it’s as simple as saying he will definitely take Lyons spot this season after he failed when he had the opportunities last year.

Other than that stretch he played nearly no midfield.

That also lined up with Lyons having a poor VFL game, a bye and then he was back into the team (albeit as the sub for every game rounds 23-GF).

They had a near perfectly healthy list at that time.

With Ashcroft likely out for 6-8 weeks, Coleman out for the season there’s definitely a strong argument Lyons plays midfield (possibly subbed but don’t see it unless he plays really poorly with a lot of other sub risks in their team right now) for at least the first 5-6 weeks which is all you need for him to make a tonne of cash and then move off of him.

Ashcroft, Coleman out for the first 6+ weeks.

Robertson, McKenna to come back in.

But there’s also Lohmann, Lester/Payne/Gardiner (one of them could easily be dropped), Ah Chee and Fletcher who could all be dropped for those 2 players as well.

Most teams have 6-7 guys who run through the middle at a bare minimum. Lyons have Neale, Dunkley, Berry and Clug (less time than last year, more outside so far) so there’s definitely room for Lyons with some rotation of Robertson and maybe Zorko at times (unlikely at his age and role imo) too.

Definitely get your sentiments around the coaches not rating him last year but he was also on the back foot all pre season too having not trained with the senior group and not selected before round 5 in the team at all. This season he seems preferred simply by starting from round 1 with Ashcroft’s injury and Zorko no longer spending time through the middle.

 

[RoyalBlue]

Touk is the cheapest he will be all year, might as well eat the bye and start him now rather than trying to get him when he's potentially put on another 50k.

Roberts is close to a must have imo, had majority of kick ins and Sydney genuinely want him in that back 6 by moving Lloyd to the wing.

Good points, but picking Miller up after at least one rookie has fattened and I have more cash to play with is my thinking. Could throw in a stinker as well and just maintain or drop a touch. At least this way I don't eat a rookie score during his bye.

Roberts now in my side for exactly the reasons you state. Worth the extra bit of cash for the potential earnings.

Everyone's trying to work out a method to deal with some teams having an extra bye. Mine is to avoid starting more than one double bye premium or midpricer on each line.
Might work, might not, but it's what I'm going to stick to and see what happens.

 

[Locus Levy Lunacy]

The thing with Robertson is he was really only selected over Lyons in rounds 18-22 when Ashcroft was out.

Robertson got to play midfield in those games and was objectively terrible so I don’t think it’s as simple as saying he will definitely take Lyons spot this season after he failed when he had the opportunities last year.

Other than that stretch he played nearly no midfield.

That also lined up with Lyons having a poor VFL game, a bye and then he was back into the team (albeit as the sub for every game rounds 23-GF).

They had a near perfectly healthy list at that time.

With Ashcroft likely out for 6-8 weeks, Coleman out for the season there’s definitely a strong argument Lyons plays midfield (possibly subbed but don’t see it unless he plays really poorly with a lot of other sub risks in their team right now) for at least the first 5-6 weeks which is all you need for him to make a tonne of cash and then move off of him.

Ashcroft, Coleman out for the first 6+ weeks.

Robertson, McKenna to come back in.

But there’s also Lohmann, Lester/Payne/Gardiner (one of them could easily be dropped), Ah Chee and Fletcher who could all be dropped for those 2 players as well.

Most teams have 6-7 guys who run through the middle at a bare minimum. Lyons have Neale, Dunkley, Berry and Clug (less time than last year, more outside so far) so there’s definitely room for Lyons with some rotation of Robertson and maybe Zorko at times (unlikely at his age and role imo) too.

Definitely get your sentiments around the coaches not rating him last year but he was also on the back foot all pre season too having not trained with the senior group and not selected before round 5 in the team at all. This season he seems preferred simply by starting from round 1 with Ashcroft’s injury and Zorko no longer spending time through the middle.

Devil's Advocate perspective:

Lyons won the Liston trophy last year, so he was playing good footy in the VFL.

The Brisbane midfield was a bit one-paced. Lyons is really just a mid. They preferred Ashcroft, then Robertson over Lyons.

Robertson (wrist) wasn't quite ready round 1, so they gave Lyons a full game in his 100th for the club.

They've lost a half back, not a mid and nothing else has changed from late last year.

I know they swing their flankers and wingers around, but do they want the core mids to go back to being Neale, Dunkley and Lyons?

 

[blue dreamer]

Just of interest, for those going Heeney, is it at the expense of someone like Fisher, or going thin somewhere else?

My current top forwards are Jackson, Flanders, Fisher, Jordon

I'd love to have a crack, serious talent, but it's a tight squeeze.

For me, Fyfe to Heeney with the cash from Darcy back to Grundy.

 

[randomcliche]

I mean this is SCS. If there's one rule it's that we must chase last week's points at all times.

Regarding the rookies this week, especially the Sydney and Collingwood ones. Do we feel that the fact that their price increases will come a week earlier might be a positive for our teams. Roberts could make enough by his bye to bring forward upgrade season by a week?

🤣🤣🤣🤣

And did Seth Campbell not do enough for a bench place.

No. Seth was very goal reliant in a team I don't see dominating.

 

[randomcliche]

So, haven't made too many changes nor taken much notice of the round 0 games but this is where I've settled

View attachment 69001

Amazing line-up. 🤣🤣🤣

 

[randomcliche]

Just of interest, for those going Heeney, is it at the expense of someone like Fisher, or going thin somewhere else?

My current top forwards are Jackson, Flanders, Fisher, Jordon

I'd love to have a crack, serious talent, but it's a tight squeeze.

I cut Sheezel for Heeney. Which unfortunately did nothing to fix my R12 bye issue. I was scraping together some extra funds for the bench as well.

 

[Blue Bloods]

Matt Crouch was on the outer at the Crows and made a comeback. Lyon seems a very similar player. Do the Lions feel they need more inside and tackles over skill.

Going to be huge or a bust, so loving this discussion over starting him or taking later. I am considering waiting to the last game and if not sub flick Fyfe to him. Not sold on Fyfe, if both sub screwed.

 

[wogitalia]

If both subs you've probably got Lohmann, Voss or Sharp as options at least. If they fail, correct next week.

 

[froffershanners]

The discussion around Lyons is truly a fascinating one.

Impossible to predict with any confidence and last game of the round is a nightmare.

For those people who think Lyons will be an integral part of the team why did they not play him until after quarter time in their main practice game and he only have less than 50% TOG?

Was he being managed or being prepared for his likely role this season and then did they pick him purely because they were playing Carlton to match their inside midfielders?

 

[Blue Bloods]

The discussion around Lyons is truly a fascinating one.

Impossible to predict with any confidence and last game of the round is a nightmare.

For those people who think Lyons will be an integral part of the team why did they not play him until after quarter time in their main practice game and he only have less than 50% TOG?

Was he being managed or being prepared for his likely role this season and then did they pick him purely because they were playing Carlton to match their inside midfielders?

Yes very possible. Carlton midfielders are very inside and not fast especially with no Walsh. Could well have been a one off.

 

[Russty_]

I've knee jerked from Gawn to Marshall to English, I remember the years when English was just a skinny garbage scorer trying to find his way, now he just dominates.

 

[Borris]

Consider my knees to be perennially jerking until Thursday 7.30pm

 

[donnybuang]

I think you really need to start Sexton on field. Its gets depressing when you see a 100 points on the bench.

I'm struggling with this right now. I want Roberts and Wilson on the field, but then the bench worries me.

 

[Darkie]

I'm struggling with this right now. I want Roberts and Wilson on the field, but then the bench worries me.

Exactly. The step down from fieldable to startable is seemingly pretty big this year.

 

[Herbie66]

I am confused then.

Given Round zero scores affect price rises , I would have thought their score would affect their BE

Oliver's was 121
Gulden's was 111
Gawn's was 104

Although since SC doesn't start until Round 1 , I guess those BE's are for Round 1.

Showing :-

Oliver 156
Gawn 137
Gulden 146

 

[Herbie66]

Petracca 131
Dunkley 130
Neale 109