Opinion Tom Liberatore - Keeper, Cash Cow or M9

Tom Liberatore's 2016 Average

  • 90-92

    Votes: 8 8.3%
  • 93-95

    Votes: 6 6.3%
  • 96-98

    Votes: 8 8.3%
  • 99-101

    Votes: 16 16.7%
  • 102-104

    Votes: 22 22.9%
  • 105-107

    Votes: 26 27.1%
  • 108-110

    Votes: 7 7.3%
  • 111-113

    Votes: 2 2.1%
  • 114+

    Votes: 1 1.0%
  • 120+

    Votes: 0 0.0%

  • Total voters
    96
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#21
Considering nab form, wouldn't Matt Crouch be the better option? He's only 12k more expensive and is tearing it up
 
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#22
Think he'll average 100-105. Good enough to keep for the majority of the season, but you'd want to try and upgrade him to a 112+ player after the byes if you have the trades to do so.

Hope he exceeds those expectations and becomes a season long keeper though.
 
Last edited:
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#23
Considering nab form, wouldn't Matt Crouch be the better option? He's only 12k more expensive and is tearing it up
i with aj. i am not sold on libba and i dont think he can avg 110. it seems matt crouch will take dangers role and he presents more value.
 
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#24
i with aj. i am not sold on libba and i dont think he can avg 110. it seems matt crouch will take dangers role and he presents more value.
He's good but no Dangerfield yet

I know you don't mean to say that but your comment suggests unrealistic expectations on a guy that like Libba hasn't played for 12 months and unlike Libba hasn't delivered 107 and 110 before.
 
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#25
He's good but no Dangerfield yet

I know you don't mean to say that but your comment suggests unrealistic expectations on a guy that like Libba hasn't played for 12 months and unlike Libba hasn't delivered 107 and 110 before.
Brad Crouch is the one who hasn't played for 12 months. Matt Crouch is the 20 year old who has played 25 games.
 
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#26
Brad Crouch is the one who hasn't played for 12 months. Matt Crouch is the 20 year old who has played 25 games.
Yes I know

I thought he meant Brad sorry. Brad is coming up more than Matt is discussions around the place.

Still, Matt hasn't delivered 110 and 107 either
 
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Collingwood
#27
He's good but no Dangerfield yet

I know you don't mean to say that but your comment suggests unrealistic expectations on a guy that like Libba hasn't played for 12 months and unlike Libba hasn't delivered 107 and 110 before.
A player who has that track record is a given at his price.
KISS. He is a gift horse. Don't over think it.
 
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#28
i with aj. i am not sold on libba and i dont think he can avg 110. it seems matt crouch will take dangers role and he presents more value.
Why do people get hung up on 110av? Heppell was top 8 mid on total points with 105. Libba was very durable before his knee.
 

IDIG

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#29
Why do people get hung up on 110av? Heppell was top 8 mid on total points with 105. Libba was very durable before his knee.
It's a fair point actually and I'm guilty of it myself. 110 just feels like the benchmark for what's acceptable but you're spot on, if he misses a bunch of games his 110 average is not much use (Beams is one that kinda springs to mind).
 
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#30
Why do people get hung up on 110av? Heppell was top 8 mid on total points with 105. Libba was very durable before his knee.
Also, didn't last years WINNER have Parker as M8 Averaging 99?
 

Bomber18

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#31
Why do people get hung up on 110av? Heppell was top 8 mid on total points with 105. Libba was very durable before his knee.
It's a fair point actually and I'm guilty of it myself. 110 just feels like the benchmark for what's acceptable but you're spot on, if he misses a bunch of games his 110 average is not much use (Beams is one that kinda springs to mind).
I think last year was a bit of an anomaly with a 105 making the top 8 on total mids as so many of the top options like Ablett, Fyfe, Rocky, Sloane had injury affected seasons.
In 2013, 2014 I feel there were more options that went 110+ over 21-22 games (although I haven't done the statistical analysis).
 
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#32
Before Libba did his knee he averaged 105 from 22 games (2013) and 110 from 22 games (2014). I would back a player with this history compared to a Crouch who has only shown glimpses. I would expect him to average at least 100 which would mean by the end of the season he will be my M8/M9.
 
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#33
The libba debate is a great one this year...I think it will be 50-50 with good coaches taking him so it could make a huge difference in the rankings. So for those in here who all count as good coaches I say back your gut and look at the balance of your side and go with it...
 

THCLT

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#36
I think I have my SC thinking cap on for today...:confused:

Yesterday was like a train wreck for me on the SC website and ended up having to hit the 'Clear Team' button!

Re the Libba debate, I think the title of this thread sums it up best. That is, are you selecting him with the expectation of being a Keeper, Cash Cow or M9? At a touch over $357k, he's right in that band of being a 'Fine Line Between Pleasure and Pain' (thanks KLo30). The one thing he has over others in this price bracket is the FACT that he's performed at Keeper's level for multiple seasons prior to his injury. So there's no doubting his potential or capacity to score, however, the landscape has changed somewhat and he's returning to a Bulldogs team with a 'new' game plan and more players rotating through their midfield. History also suggests that players returning from such injury takes a while to regain the confidence and trust in their movements so I think it would be wise to take 10% of his previous average. Hence a realistic expectation would be 95, not the 105 which we know is in him but maybe not for 2016.

Personally for me, it's currently between him and B Crouch for that one midfield spot. Come round 1 though, if an Angus Brayshaw of 2015 appears then I'd take the rookie and use the funds to upgrade my defence.

My final advice would be that if you're ever 50/50 on a selection, especially in the 'Pleasure and Pain' price bracket, then don't commit your overall team structure to that selection and let that be the last selection decision you make when finalising your team. If no better options are available then just take Libba and run.
 
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#37
I think I have my SC thinking cap on for today...:confused:

Yesterday was like a train wreck for me on the SC website and ended up having to hit the 'Clear Team' button!

Re the Libba debate, I think the title of this thread sums it up best. That is, are you selecting him with the expectation of being a Keeper, Cash Cow or M9? At a touch over $357k, he's right in that band of being a 'Fine Line Between Pleasure and Pain' (thanks KLo30). The one thing he has over others in this price bracket is the FACT that he's performed at Keeper's level for multiple seasons prior to his injury. So there's no doubting his potential or capacity to score, however, the landscape has changed somewhat and he's returning to a Bulldogs team with a 'new' game plan and more players rotating through their midfield. History also suggests that players returning from such injury takes a while to regain the confidence and trust in their movements so I think it would be wise to take 10% of his previous average. Hence a realistic expectation would be 95, not the 105 which we know is in him but maybe not for 2016.

Personally for me, it's currently between him and B Crouch for that one midfield spot. Come round 1 though, if an Angus Brayshaw of 2015 appears then I'd take the rookie and use the funds to upgrade my defence.

My final advice would be that if you're ever 50/50 on a selection, especially in the 'Pleasure and Pain' price bracket, then don't commit your overall team structure to that selection and let that be the last selection decision you make when finalising your team. If no better options are available then just take Libba and run.
This is indeed the question for some as their M5. Crouch M./B. or Liberatore. Liberatore with the runs on the board for me.
 
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#38
Totally agree with you Thanh.
My team is pretty much set with the exception of whether to have Libba or to have 2 rookies instead.
Wise words and a timely reminder!
 

THCLT

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#39
Totally agree with you Thanh.
My team is pretty much set with the exception of whether to have Libba or to have 2 rookies instead.
Wise words and a timely reminder!
Thanks MMM...so I guess the light on my SC thinking cap is blinking for now...lol
 

Bomber18

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#40
I think I have my SC thinking cap on for today...:confused:

Yesterday was like a train wreck for me on the SC website and ended up having to hit the 'Clear Team' button!

Re the Libba debate, I think the title of this thread sums it up best. That is, are you selecting him with the expectation of being a Keeper, Cash Cow or M9? At a touch over $357k, he's right in that band of being a 'Fine Line Between Pleasure and Pain' (thanks KLo30). The one thing he has over others in this price bracket is the FACT that he's performed at Keeper's level for multiple seasons prior to his injury. So there's no doubting his potential or capacity to score, however, the landscape has changed somewhat and he's returning to a Bulldogs team with a 'new' game plan and more players rotating through their midfield. History also suggests that players returning from such injury takes a while to regain the confidence and trust in their movements so I think it would be wise to take 10% of his previous average. Hence a realistic expectation would be 95, not the 105 which we know is in him but maybe not for 2016.

Personally for me, it's currently between him and B Crouch for that one midfield spot. Come round 1 though, if an Angus Brayshaw of 2015 appears then I'd take the rookie and use the funds to upgrade my defence.

My final advice would be that if you're ever 50/50 on a selection, especially in the 'Pleasure and Pain' price bracket, then don't commit your overall team structure to that selection and let that be the last selection decision you make when finalising your team. If no better options are available then just take Libba and run.
I think you're spot on the money here. In my own situation, I'm thinking of using him as a cash cow where after a period of high scoring (hopefully around the byes), I can sideswap him to a better top 6-8 option. B.Crouch is a good option too to perform that cash cow role, but I just can't take a risk on a player with such a injury history.
 
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