Position 2022: Defender Discussion

[freowho]

Showed no evidence to support it last year when he played the role for a substantial chunk of the season. Hard part with them is for some reason Ratten wants Howard taking kick-ins so you lose that consistent source and that all of Wilkie, Sinclair, Paton and Webster are good rebounders themselves, nowhere near the level of funneling as at North.

Ultimately he's a lazy player who doesn't intercept or win the ball basically at all himself, rarely tackles and isn't that good a kick, despite mostly playing that role he's a solid 10+% behind the likes of Lloyd, Ziebell, Stewart and Ridley and 5%+ on most of the others up the top. He hits some excellent kicks but he also takes on a lot of kicks that aren't there and has a very annoying habit of trying to make absurd kicks on his right foot when a simple left foot would do that often become clangers, his 65 clangers is very high and the people who are around that like Rich and Salem had 200 more possessions, heck Lloyd had 200 more touches and 14 less clangers.

I do think he's going to improve, Coffield and Paton is not a like for like switch from a ball use/want perspective. If he can not have as many games in the 40s and even the 70s he could push a long way. I think ultimately he strikes as more of a 90 guy than the 100 you'd be chasing to leave some room for a miss.

There's also the fact that he handles a tag worse than perhaps any player in the history of the sport so if he does start to become genuinely damaging off half back it's a very easy choice to tag him and watch him go home which given he's not playing any defense at the best of times can be an even bigger issue.

I sound overly harsh here as I think he's got great value in draft leagues and even in classic he probably pushes the 100k price gain mark and he's definitely in the best few options in his price range, I just think that price range needs to include a realistic keeper outcome, last year he played wing and rebounding HBF, two of the friendliest roles in the sport and managed 4 scores above 88 in 22 games. For comparison Rioli did that twice, with another 87 and 83 in 6 games in the role. Personally I think Rioli at 60k less offers almost the exact same prospect in a team that's got a much stronger history of producing elite scoring defenders.

Is he the most overpaid AFL player? Polec would also be a chance.

 

[arpod]

I can understand the question given the role change but unlikely. I haven't looked at any stats but the eye test suggests Hill is a fairly uncontested player and even though players like Hall and Ziebell move to uncontested roles they at least have some history in contested positions and don't avoid the contest. Not sure I've done a great job of explaining that.
A good seagull will still go through traffic when needed.

Showed no evidence to support it last year when he played the role for a substantial chunk of the season. Hard part with them is for some reason Ratten wants Howard taking kick-ins so you lose that consistent source and that all of Wilkie, Sinclair, Paton and Webster are good rebounders themselves, nowhere near the level of funneling as at North.

Ultimately he's a lazy player who doesn't intercept or win the ball basically at all himself, rarely tackles and isn't that good a kick, despite mostly playing that role he's a solid 10+% behind the likes of Lloyd, Ziebell, Stewart and Ridley and 5%+ on most of the others up the top. He hits some excellent kicks but he also takes on a lot of kicks that aren't there and has a very annoying habit of trying to make absurd kicks on his right foot when a simple left foot would do that often become clangers, his 65 clangers is very high and the people who are around that like Rich and Salem had 200 more possessions, heck Lloyd had 200 more touches and 14 less clangers.

I do think he's going to improve, Coffield and Paton is not a like for like switch from a ball use/want perspective. If he can not have as many games in the 40s and even the 70s he could push a long way. I think ultimately he strikes as more of a 90 guy than the 100 you'd be chasing to leave some room for a miss.

There's also the fact that he handles a tag worse than perhaps any player in the history of the sport so if he does start to become genuinely damaging off half back it's a very easy choice to tag him and watch him go home which given he's not playing any defense at the best of times can be an even bigger issue.

I sound overly harsh here as I think he's got great value in draft leagues and even in classic he probably pushes the 100k price gain mark and he's definitely in the best few options in his price range, I just think that price range needs to include a realistic keeper outcome, last year he played wing and rebounding HBF, two of the friendliest roles in the sport and managed 4 scores above 88 in 22 games. For comparison Rioli did that twice, with another 87 and 83 in 6 games in the role. Personally I think Rioli at 60k less offers almost the exact same prospect in a team that's got a much stronger history of producing elite scoring defenders.

Thanks ... I really don't like him as a player either for many of those reasons! But the role and the points meant worth investigating. I hadn't seen any games, and didn't realise they'd tried to re-invent him down back last year after how bad he was early in the year. The good thing is that even if he starts well, it's not like I'll be missing out due to his low ownership numbers. One of the weirder recruiting targets in recent years to my eye. Especially as they were kicking someone like Hind out the door, playing him as a deep pressure forward.

 

[BarginHunter]

Anyone else worried about McCartin? I know we are desperate for cheapish players and such due to rookie drought BUT, is this the same McCartin that left the Saints due to multiple concussions? If so, do we reckon he wont get knocked again?

 

[wogitalia]

Is he the most overpaid AFL player? Polec would also be a chance.

Sadly I reckon Buddy is right up there if you ignore the off field value that he creates. Heeney is also a contender from our side, he's good but he's not a top 5 or so player in the league like his contract says, especially playing as a forward. For comparison on Buddy, he's paid roughly the same as Gawn and Petracca combined and I know which I'd rather...

Coniglio on the last couple of years is definitely a strong contender.

But yeah, I think Hill is the easy winner given he has none of the off field value of a Buddy and no leadership or intangible value either, he's a pure on field product and he's not been remotely good for St Kilda.

Anyone else worried about McCartin? I know we are desperate for cheapish players and such due to rookie drought BUT, is this the same McCartin that left the Saints due to multiple concussions? If so, do we reckon he wont get knocked again?

It's obviously a risk but if you can find me another rookie that's actually best 22, has shown any inkling of scoring potential and costs within 20k of him, please let me know because I haven't found that.

SDK is a lock if he's picked, he's a solid D7-8.

Hinge is 180k, has a shoulder that's had more problems than Paddy in the past couple of years and hasn't shown any real scoring so far with a couple of 50 type scores.

Gibcus is battling for a spot, costs more and has shown considerably less scoring potential in a more dour role.

Boyd is probably the next most likely to play right now and I'm not sure he'd play if Docherty isn't fit, nevermind if he is.

Sinn as absolute best case scenario the 21st man picked in a team going for a flag is also not really selling strongly.

Desperate times call for desperate measures. Right now McCartin is clearly first for mine for the one I'd trust on field which is kind of disgusting

 

[Shannon]

Anyone else worried about McCartin? I know we are desperate for cheapish players and such due to rookie drought BUT, is this the same McCartin that left the Saints due to multiple concussions? If so, do we reckon he wont get knocked again?

Not sure if you have seen him playing for the swans in their preseason games but he has looked very solid as a key defender - reads the play well, looks very comfortable back there. I have more confidence in him than any of the other rookie priced defenders, happy to start him on the field.

 

[Santoz]

Please let me know who you're taking down back if taking SDK out!

 

[donnybuang]

Is he the most overpaid AFL player? Polec would also be a chance.

Darling was up until today.

 

[Herbie66]

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Might be the way to go in the end , something has to give somewhere.

 

[Woodsey]

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Wow!! If teams don’t go the way we want can certainly see this being a viable option. With this structure do you only have room for one Uber premium, Neale, Cripps & Rowell?

 

[Woodsey]

Hall back at training doing full match sim so very confident he will be named. Currently in 2% of teams - great POD and based on his role, could well be the top defender for the year. Let’s hope not too many pick him up before Rd 1.

 

[AngryAnt]

Hall back at training doing full match sim so very confident he will be named. Currently in 2% of teams - great POD and based on his role, could well be the top defender for the year. Let’s hope not too many pick him up before Rd 1.

Go the completely safe yet boring and not particularly value pick in Crisp or the risky but potentially under-priced Hall? hmm

 

[Ben's Beasts]

Hall back at training doing full match sim so very confident he will be named. Currently in 2% of teams - great POD and based on his role, could well be the top defender for the year. Let’s hope not too many pick him up before Rd 1.

Highly likely he would be in my round 1 team if not for the heavily interrupted pre-season but based on that he seems like an upgrade target to me.

 

[AngryAnt]

Anyone else worried about McCartin? I know we are desperate for cheapish players and such due to rookie drought BUT, is this the same McCartin that left the Saints due to multiple concussions? If so, do we reckon he wont get knocked again?

The one i'm worried about the least right now. Hinge's shoulder being attached to his torso by duct tape is more worrisome right now. Starting to think that a mid pricer in Chapman could be an option for D5, has the scope to score 80 ppg which would be good enough for his price.

 

[dlanod]

Wow!! If teams don’t go the way we want can certainly see this being a viable option. With this structure do you only have room for one Uber premium, Neale, Cripps & Rowell?

That's what I'm running, but then I've been drinking a lot too.

 

[Socrates2]

Darcy Wilmot $139,000 may be an option as a round 1 loophole who plays in round 2 after his suspension.
I'm not sure if he is in their best 22 but if he is this could be an option.

 

[Woodsey]

heavily interrupted pre-season but based on that he seems like an upgrade target to me.

I don’t think his preseason was heavily interrupted. Participated in all sessions and then went off with the small hamstring niggle with the praccy. Might be enough not to be starting him but I do have my blue and white glasses on and we will be in my team lol

 

[Ben's Beasts]

I don’t think his preseason was heavily interrupted. Participated in all sessions and then went off with the small hamstring niggle with the praccy. Might be enough not to be starting him but I do have my blue and white glasses on and we will be in my team lol

Small hamstring niggle?

Didn’t he miss several weeks on the track as a result?

 

[Santoz]

Wow!! If teams don’t go the way we want can certainly see this being a viable option. With this structure do you only have room for one Uber premium, Neale, Cripps & Rowell?

Uber, Neale, Cripps, Berry & Caldwell.

 

[dlanod]

Darcy Wilmot $139,000 may be an option as a round 1 loophole who plays in round 2 after his suspension.
I'm not sure if he is in their best 22 but if he is this could be an option.

Don't hold your breath on him playing Round 2.

He may, but I'd suggest he's behind Madden and Ah Chee.

 

[Toothless Tigers]

Is he the most overpaid AFL player? Polec would also be a chance.

McGovern - Carlton @ 800K per season for 5 years....