2014: Retirements, Delistings and Trade Rumours
- Thread starter IDIG
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No doubt anyone would love Dangerfield in there team but even if we did land him it's not gonna save collingwood in 2015.
A game plan that doesnt expose our players poor skills by foot may help.
The hawks gamestyle can not be implemented as we just dont have the skill by foot nor the foot speed to make it work.
Gonna be a rough season for my boys.
A game plan that doesnt expose our players poor skills by foot may help.
The hawks gamestyle can not be implemented as we just dont have the skill by foot nor the foot speed to make it work.
Gonna be a rough season for my boys.
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- Hawthorn
Goodes playing on has cost the Swans a quality 3rd forward. Looked very good in his one game, and has kicked over 100 goals in the reserves up there. No wonder he wants to get some senior opportunities, personally can't see why the Swans would rather have Goodes filling up space in the forward line ahead of a 20 year old up and coming 'potential' star.
In 2012 I did a piece/thread on nearly this exact equation!
[2012] The Collingwood Conundrum (expanded)
I would think it no doubt helps him, but with Sidebottom, and the likes of Thomas and Elliott coming through, it still raises doubts about his ability to get back to 110+ levels. I guess it comes down to exactly how much he was hampered by wrist injury/glandular fever last year, and how well he he comes up in 2015. It is interesting though.
[2012] The Collingwood Conundrum (expanded)
I would think it no doubt helps him, but with Sidebottom, and the likes of Thomas and Elliott coming through, it still raises doubts about his ability to get back to 110+ levels. I guess it comes down to exactly how much he was hampered by wrist injury/glandular fever last year, and how well he he comes up in 2015. It is interesting though.
It's very interesting indeed. Swan would probably be worth a punt if he is available as a forward. I seriously doubt that though.
There's many interesting questions that can be posed in a similar manner. The big one for me is whether the arrival of Beams would seriously hinder Rockliff's scoring or not..?
There's many interesting questions that can be posed in a similar manner. The big one for me is whether the arrival of Beams would seriously hinder Rockliff's scoring or not..?
It is actually the Hawks game plan that helps their kicking accuracy. They avoid kicking over the man on the mark and avoid leading straight at the guy with the ball so he doesn't have to kick it over the man on the mark. When you kick over the man on the mark the ball pops up in the air which gives the opposition more chance to get to it. When you kick to the side of the man on mark you can keep the ball lower reducing the oppositions chances of getting to the ball. It is also easier to kick the ball out in front of someone leading to the side as opposed to leading directly at you because you don't have to weight the kick, you only have to pick a direction. If you kick it too far out in front the ball is still to the advantage of your team mate.
So Hawthorn work diagonally up the ground almost like a yacht tacking into the wind. The diagonal movement also lets them pick apart opposition defensive strategies which are often in a grid formation across the ground.
I get annoyed watching my own team kick it long down the line where the ball just gets bombed in the air or trying to switch the play by going completely to the other side of the ground when with better running patterns they could work their way through the middle of the ground.
So Hawthorn work diagonally up the ground almost like a yacht tacking into the wind. The diagonal movement also lets them pick apart opposition defensive strategies which are often in a grid formation across the ground.
I get annoyed watching my own team kick it long down the line where the ball just gets bombed in the air or trying to switch the play by going completely to the other side of the ground when with better running patterns they could work their way through the middle of the ground.
North being on the front foot last season with trades was good to see as a supporter. In saying that, i'm still not sure why they got Nahas. This season they have been on the front foot again and snagged Waite and Higgins. Unfortunately both Waite and Higgins haven't been able to stay on the park long enough to show how good they could be over a full season. Waite will be 32 at the start of next season making him a 2-3 year investment at very best. Higgins while only 26, has had horrible luck with injuries. Adding Waite (31yrs) to players such as Harvey (36yrs), Petrie (32yrs), Firrito (31yrs), Dal Santo (30yrs), Wells (29yrs) and Grima (29yrs) is starting to make the list look a bit aged. Within 3 years i would expect all of these players to have retired except maybe Grima.
The big question i want to ask is, does the inclusion of Waite and Higgins move the club forward and into premiership contention in the next 2-3 years?
The big question i want to ask is, does the inclusion of Waite and Higgins move the club forward and into premiership contention in the next 2-3 years?
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Still think North are one genuine star player in midfield from being a serious threat. Clearly them getting Waite from us is a belief you are in premiership window though given how many 30 and over players you have at North. North are stretched down back with Thompson and Grima trying to stop big key forwards of opposition. They need Tippett to really step up as tall key defender. Waite himself made a joke of your key defenders when he played on them last time. So certainly need to improve in a number of areas. The general game plan North played with suits their style though. Only need to get better at it and add a few more stars or develop stars from within to have a hope. North need Levi Greenwood and Wells to have big years next year to at least keep pace with where they were at as a team. Ben Brown was excellent find. Ziebell playing stints forward was really good move to. Not sure how Petrie, Waite, Brown and Black all work together in forward line though. Is Black capable of turning into a key backman ?
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As a Carlton supporter, with no Tom Mitchell on trade table I do not feel like there is much to get excited at for my club. Looks like re-build time has to be the priority. Trading Lucas, Robinson and Garlett for some draft picks seems about all I can expect. Feel like my club is completely off the rails with direction of coaching. Have little confidence in Malthouse. He knows what he wants to do, I'm sure of that. But whether it actually works I have little reason to be confident. Apart from him turning Sam Rowe into a key defender I struggle to find much positives of his own impact. Probably Casboult the other guy he has had a positive impact on as far as developing but Casboult still has a long way to go with his kicking. Right now we only seem to have Henderson as a key forward that can kick goals. But he is very good player. Not an out and out star key forward. Menzel and Buckley hopefully keep developing. Cripps over a broken leg should get a regular gig next season so will be interesting to see if he can become our prime inside mid for the next decade. Kruezer needs to play 18 plus games and become a full fledged star. Otherwise we are going nowhere at all except middle of ladder at best.
The only thing that gives me any hope is there is no super sides in league at moment so if you improve in leaps and bounds it is not impossible to get to the top of the league mountain. Most of the better sides now only have 3 or 4 genuine stars. If you can find 2 or 3 from within that develop all of a sudden you can get well above middle of ladder. There is not a lot of difference from top to bottom any more. The difference in general is the game plans. The teams at top are very clear on their game plans and players tend to stick to them majority of times.
I still expect Gold Coast, GWS and Sydney to be regular finalist in next 5 years and have best chance of flag success.
They seem to have best chance of having more stars to develop from within.
The only thing that gives me any hope is there is no super sides in league at moment so if you improve in leaps and bounds it is not impossible to get to the top of the league mountain. Most of the better sides now only have 3 or 4 genuine stars. If you can find 2 or 3 from within that develop all of a sudden you can get well above middle of ladder. There is not a lot of difference from top to bottom any more. The difference in general is the game plans. The teams at top are very clear on their game plans and players tend to stick to them majority of times.
I still expect Gold Coast, GWS and Sydney to be regular finalist in next 5 years and have best chance of flag success.
They seem to have best chance of having more stars to develop from within.
An interesting read Oz, with the introdction of GWS and GC there's now an extra 44 guys each week running out playing AFL that woud've missed out, i think that means the genuine stars are spread a bit thinner and also means at the other end clubs are having to stick with mediocre players and try to "train" them into being players. That and finding quality mature age players like Puoplo. It also means the trade talk around superstars like Dangerfield is reaching fever pitch and getting a bit ridiculous, i don't ever remember such rumour and innuendo getting around about a player still under contract for a year who's pretty much has said he wants to stay but just wants to negotiate a good deal.
I don't know whether it makes the competition better or not, it seems like the "Club Loyalty" thing fans are asked to subscribe to doesn't get returned by a lot of the players now.
I don't know whether it makes the competition better or not, it seems like the "Club Loyalty" thing fans are asked to subscribe to doesn't get returned by a lot of the players now.
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Yep. The league has expanded from 12 teams to 14 teams to 15 team to 16 teams and now to 18 teams in time I been following and the talent has been spread thinner and thinner. At the same time salary cap and drafts came into football so it generally is spread more evenly at same time as thinner. There has been the odd exception but generally basically talent spread more evenly. On one hand it is harder to win a premiership as a club as you gone from 1 of 12 clubs to now 1 of 18. Statistically 1 in 12 chance to 1 in 18. However, at same time the teams at top can never become as star filled as they once were so you see less stars or fully fledged stars in the premier team because of there being a salary cap now that more ingrained in league equalisation format. So our clubs are also closer to being able to assemble a team that has ability to steal a flag with possibly only really two or three champs in the team and team game plan more important than ever. Coaching is super important and things like fitness coach at Port being best by a mile can really be shown to made a big difference with lists all relatively even. List managers need to earn their coin. The one at Geelong been a friggin gem at it for some time. My club coaching staff, fitness people and list management seems well off the pace. We got run off the rails by John Elliott and never recovered. Essendon fans should worry about where their club goes in coming years as when your club is run bad it can have impacts for more than a decade.
I don't understand the idea of fans being asked to subscribe to loyalty. You either support a club or not. You don't always have to like how they are run but your club is your club. Clubs with players is a different thing. The players now are paid to the level of replacing and not really allowing for a full time job whilst they play so whilst many fall in and out of love with their club the reality is if there is a difference of a couple of hundred thousands being on offer from different clubs and different contract lengths players have to treat their own footy career a bit more professionally than just playing for the club they want to play with most. For example, I have no doubt Waite would have loved to play out his career as a one club player with Carlton but I'm sure he consulted his wife and the difference in pay can impact family life. You got to consider other offers even if you prefer to stay. If the offer is too good to refuse you almost got to take it. You got 40 to 60 years after your footy career is over. If you can earn $200 to $300 k more in your last couple of years with a different club and your family members think you need to take it, well I would think the pull to stay with your original club becomes less of a factor. Players need to treat their careers more than ever as a profession. Even if they love it and would essentially play it for nothing they still need to consider the rest of their life and sometimes their small time of life as footy player maybe the best chance to make some good coin in their whole life. Eddie Betts simply had to leave Carlton for Adelaide for the coin difference on it's own. The guy can barely read and write so he needs to make the most of what he can earn as a footy player whilst he is still playing. As a loyal Carlton supporter I would never begrudge guys like Eddie Betts and Waite leaving if the difference in pay and length of contract is significant. Having said that, I will always look at someone like Aaron Hamill years ago being dis-loyal due to circumstances of leaving were very different. You also got to take into account some players will leave a club because they either do not get on with coaching staff, treated badly or never really wanted to be drafted by the club they got drafted to in first place.
I don't understand the idea of fans being asked to subscribe to loyalty. You either support a club or not. You don't always have to like how they are run but your club is your club. Clubs with players is a different thing. The players now are paid to the level of replacing and not really allowing for a full time job whilst they play so whilst many fall in and out of love with their club the reality is if there is a difference of a couple of hundred thousands being on offer from different clubs and different contract lengths players have to treat their own footy career a bit more professionally than just playing for the club they want to play with most. For example, I have no doubt Waite would have loved to play out his career as a one club player with Carlton but I'm sure he consulted his wife and the difference in pay can impact family life. You got to consider other offers even if you prefer to stay. If the offer is too good to refuse you almost got to take it. You got 40 to 60 years after your footy career is over. If you can earn $200 to $300 k more in your last couple of years with a different club and your family members think you need to take it, well I would think the pull to stay with your original club becomes less of a factor. Players need to treat their careers more than ever as a profession. Even if they love it and would essentially play it for nothing they still need to consider the rest of their life and sometimes their small time of life as footy player maybe the best chance to make some good coin in their whole life. Eddie Betts simply had to leave Carlton for Adelaide for the coin difference on it's own. The guy can barely read and write so he needs to make the most of what he can earn as a footy player whilst he is still playing. As a loyal Carlton supporter I would never begrudge guys like Eddie Betts and Waite leaving if the difference in pay and length of contract is significant. Having said that, I will always look at someone like Aaron Hamill years ago being dis-loyal due to circumstances of leaving were very different. You also got to take into account some players will leave a club because they either do not get on with coaching staff, treated badly or never really wanted to be drafted by the club they got drafted to in first place.
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