Analysis SuperCoach Scoring Explained, Observations & Complaints On Scoring

Rowsus

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I've watched the vid below and it's amusing that Dusty got awarded any of these tackles. He was definitely awarded these as AFL statspro has time stamps of when stats are awarded (as this guy also notes). Tackle no.6 was awarded after the siren in a post match adjustment, which probably contributed to Dusty's score being scaled from low 150s to 160! Wonder if CD will be a bit stricter with him since they've been called out?

Jackson 'JD' Davey
‏@jacksondavey
Hi @championdata and @AFL. Are you able to explain why @DustinMartin4 was awarded seven tackles in Round 2 of the Adelaide v Richmond game?
Using the new AFL stats pro I did a quick and dirty compile of all tackles: https://youtu.be/tGFQ0ZhaRQs
CC: @Supercoach @AFLFantasy
Two points:

I've said all along, that players like Dangerfield, Dusty etc are on an "easier" grading than others. What one player gets as a poor disposal and a clanger, they don't. Danger turned the ball over on Monday, and it directly resulted in a Hawthorn goal. No clanger was recorded. Lobb kicked the ball around 35 metres while under pressure, to a contest, albeit a contest where the opposition held an advantage, and was given a clanger.
Put players like Lobbs clangers on a tape like that Martin Tackle tape, and then compare it to some of Dangerfield's "non-clangers", and you will be equally mystified. The callers, and those that make these decisions are only human, but I've been saying it for years, they have favourite players they are starry eyed over, that can do very little wrong. Sometimes they get awarded CP's, where in same situation the mere mortal's just get P's. Sometimes their efforts seemed to get over graded, when compared to an identical act a minute or two later.
Unfortunately, the opposite happens too. Sometimes they take a set against a player, and he can't do anything right.
Lobb again last week. Took a contested mark, in the Def arc, and kicked a long effective kick, and received a total of 4 points.
Not even 2 minutes later, Finlayson did exactly the same thing, and received a total of 13 points.
It's inexplicable, as are many parts of the scoring of this game we love. Why do players who started a game well, seemingly rewarded more points, for very little effort, later in the game, compared to players who have had a bad night? Time after time I have seen a scenario, particularly when it looks like the game is over, where player A doing well in a game, say on 120 with 5 minutes to go, will mark and goal, and get his full points awarded. Then moments later, or even just before, player B, who is struggling along on 50 points, does the same, and gets a total of about 6 points. How is one worth more than the other, just because player A was having a good night compared to player B?
Very frustrating!

My second point on the Dusty tape is, while I can't see all 7 should have been awarded tackles, try watching it with this definition in mind:
A pressure act, involving physical contact with the opposition ball carrier, that results in a stoppage, turnover or the ball going into dispute.
One or two of the doubtful ones become tackles, using that (my own) definition.
Still, no doubt in my mind, if that was say Florent, and not Martin, it might have resulted in 4 or 5 tackles being awarded, not 7.
 
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Anyone else think CD awards effective hard ball gets with way to many points? In a regular game they receive anything from 3-5 points and I just saw this from the latest CD Herald Sun article:

Kelly’s goal at the 12-minute mark of the final term was worth a match-high 9.47 points, with his next possession (a hardball-get) earning him 6.33 points.

Obviously there's scaling involved but these two touches were pretty close to one another in a game that was in the balance at that point. Completely understand the methodology of the scoring but still find it hard to believe that a handball is worth nearly as much as a goal!
 
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Anyone else think CD awards effective hard ball gets with way to many points? In a regular game they receive anything from 3-5 points and I just saw this from the latest CD Herald Sun article:

Kelly’s goal at the 12-minute mark of the final term was worth a match-high 9.47 points, with his next possession (a hardball-get) earning him 6.33 points.

Obviously there's scaling involved but these two touches were pretty close to one another in a game that was in the balance at that point. Completely understand the methodology of the scoring but still find it hard to believe that a handball is worth nearly as much as a goal!
Yeah I agree, I think goals should be adjusted based on difficulty of distance. For example, a shot from Kelly’s distance could be 7 or 8, while a goal from the goal square could stay at 6.
 
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LIVE SuperCoach scores are a fantastic way to track your players — and your league opponents’ — in real time. They can also send you a bit crazy.

Midfielders generally score evenly across a match — so if one of your starters has 30 points at quarter-time or 60 at halftime, they are usually tracking for a three-figure score. If they enter the main break with just 25 to their name, you’re in strife.

But other players can be far more volatile. Just ask the 61,000 SuperCoach players with Carlton gun Kade Simpson in their team.

Scroll down to see the numbers behind Simpson’s rollercoaster day, the secret to Jack Billings’ return to form and the full impact of Jack Macrae’s hamstring injury as Champion Data lifts the lid on the quirkiest SuperCoach scores of Round 13.

SIMPSON RISES FROM GRAVE

Like Carlton, Kade Simpson was lacklustre in the first half against Fremantle and his score was indicative of this, heading into the major break with 37 points to his name.

But he was rampant in the third term as he piled on 66 points from 18 disposals and seven intercept possessions. He scored 40 points from disposals alone, adding a further 5.3 points from a big pack mark off the opposition. Simpson also earned points for one block and one running bounce.

He wasn’t as prominent in the final term, but he still added 20 points to his score to finish with 123 for the match, ranked third on the ground behind Nat Fyfe and Lachie Neale.

THE REBIRTH OF BILLINGS

A move to the wing, where he spent 69 per cent of the match against Gold Coast, was the catalyst to Jack Billings’ form reversal.

He had his most prominent match since the season opener against Brisbane, recording a season-high 27 disposals and four tackles.

Billings finished with 99 points for the match and lost just six points from two disposal clangers. He also did the little things, scoring 4.6 points from one smother and two effective spoils.

Billings’ most prominent act of the match was a contested mark in the opening term which earned him 4.7 points.

GRESHAM’S BIG FINISH

Jade Gresham proved to be the matchwinner for St Kilda in the come-from-behind win on Saturday, scoring 59 points in the final term. With the match in the balance late in the quarter, his goal was worth 14.5 points. If you add the gather from the hitout and the kick short for goal, then the whole play was worth 25 points.

Daniel McKenzie (45 points), Seb Ross (32) and Hunter Clark and Billy Longer (30) were all prominent in the time-on period of that quarter. Jack Billings, on the other hand, had zero points during that time.

JACK POTHOLE

Owners of Jack Macrae were dealt a double blow on the weekend. He scored an injury-affected 51 points and plummeted in price by a massive $73,600.

We have to go back to the first price changes of the season in Round 3 to see a bigger drop, with Tom Rockliff (-75,600) and Zach Merrett (-$86,100) both losing significant value.
 

IDIG

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Thx mate! So you get points for a running bounce lol

This is good to know:
With the match in the balance late in the quarter, his goal was worth 14.5 points. If you add the gather from the hitout and the kick short for goal, then the whole play was worth 25 points.

What’s that work out to be loose/hard ball get + clearance + short kick = 10.5 pts plus 14.5 for the goal with the game in the balance.

Will keep my eye on that.
 
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Thx mate! So you get points for a running bounce lol

This is good to know:
With the match in the balance late in the quarter, his goal was worth 14.5 points. If you add the gather from the hitout and the kick short for goal, then the whole play was worth 25 points.

What’s that work out to be loose/hard ball get + clearance + short kick = 10.5 pts plus 14.5 for the goal with the game in the balance.

Will keep my eye on that.
Yeah one point for a bounce.

With Gresham, it wouldn’t be a hard/loose ball get. A gather from hitout is not rewarded as much, normally only worth 1 point, as the ruckman is doing all the good work, while loose/hard ball gets are contested possessions, so they’re 3 each. Clearances also don’t get any bonus.

So it would normally be 1 for the gather from hitout, 3 for the kick, and 6 for the goal = 10 points. In this case it was probably 3 for the gather, 7.5 for the kick, and 14.5 for the goal.
 

IDIG

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Yeah one point for a bounce.

With Gresham, it wouldn’t be a hard/loose ball get. A gather from hitout is not rewarded as much, normally only worth 1 point, as the ruckman is doing all the good work, while loose/hard ball gets are contested possessions, so they’re 3 each. Clearances also don’t get any bonus.

So it would normally be 1 for the gather from hitout, 3 for the kick, and 6 for the goal = 10 points. In this case it was probably 3 for the gather, 7.5 for the kick, and 14.5 for the goal.
Whattttt clearances don’t you get you points? Well you learn something everyday. Been playing this forever and have always thought they did but come to think of it, the gather and possession is essentially the same thing.

Not sure about bounces getting a point lol
 
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Whattttt clearances don’t you get you points? Well you learn something everyday. Been playing this forever and have always thought they did but come to think of it, the gather and possession is essentially the same thing.

Not sure about bounces getting a point lol
Yeh haha common misconception. You get the points for a possession or disposal, but spacial things like clearances and inside 50s don’t matter for SuperCoach are far as I’m aware. I think you do get marginally extra points for possessions and disposals in the offensive 50/defensive 50 though.
 
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I think the whole ground is scaled and any score earnt or lost in a particular spot on the ground is multiplied by the likelihood of a score being generated from that spot on the ground. My understanding is that at the same time a caller is giving information to be punched into the computer the ball is being tracked for it's position on the ground. So points earnt or lost in the goal square might be multiplied by 2 while points earnt or lost on the boundary in the middle of the ground which is the furthest point from the goals might be multiplied by a half. So it is misleading to watch the points go up and down during the game and then suggest one player is getting underscored unless you are taking into account the position of the ball, the number of players around the ball and the state of the scoreboard.
 
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So other than clangers/ineffective disposals turnovers ect how can a players score go down from there current score. To often I’ve watched e.g the weekend jack billing’s starts off on fire and is up to 26-27points only to look 4-5 min later haven’t been sighted or on the bench and his score has dropped to 23-24? Do they have to keep getting the ball or 1%ers to keep the score status quo? I see this happen with a few players all to often
 
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So other than clangers/ineffective disposals turnovers ect how can a players score go down from there current score. To often I’ve watched e.g the weekend jack billing’s starts off on fire and is up to 26-27points only to look 4-5 min later haven’t been sighted or on the bench and his score has dropped to 23-24? Do they have to keep getting the ball or 1%ers to keep the score status quo? I see this happen with a few players all to often
I don’t know for sure, but if I had to guess I would say it involves reweighting the scores based on overall points scored so far in the match with a view to ensuring that the total score for the match equals 3300.
 
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So other than clangers/ineffective disposals turnovers ect how can a players score go down from there current score. To often I’ve watched e.g the weekend jack billing’s starts off on fire and is up to 26-27points only to look 4-5 min later haven’t been sighted or on the bench and his score has dropped to 23-24? Do they have to keep getting the ball or 1%ers to keep the score status quo? I see this happen with a few players all to often
1 touch when the game just began with only a few disposals having occured has more of an impact compared to 1 touch out of around 700 disposals a game.

So early on in the game when not much has happened, each scoring act has played a greater role on the flow of the game relatively.
 

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Yeah i'm a little concerned about the JS of a few of those rookies as well. Not sure if paying a premium for Ridley/Collins is the way to go but it's something i've been considering.

Not too fussed about Short. Early days yet and got himself back into the game late to muster a half decent score when 30-40 was looking likely. I'm not too attached to him and he'll be one of the first to go if there's no benefit for him taking the kick-ins. From what i saw, all he was doing was bombing it long, which is great for his team but bad for his score because none of his kicks were actually 'effective'.

EDIT: oh and nah will pass on the IPL comp. Struggling to stay on top of everything as it is.
Worth flagging that I think any kick over 40 metres is treated as effective.

I wonder what happens if it's in the wrong direction? :unsure:
 

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Worth flagging that I think any kick over 40 metres is treated as effective.

I wonder what happens if it's in the wrong direction? :unsure:
Oh right. I must be getting old and senile but I thought for him to gain points via an effective kick, it needs to go to his teammate, not to a contest where the ball is in dispute. Might need to brush up on the sc pts scoring system o_O

Edit: moved to scoring thread
Editx2: ok found it. The amount of pts might’ve changed but the kick classification probably hasn’t changed.



There is a distinct difference between an effective long kick (1 point from a kick in or 3 in general play) and a long kick to advantage (3 or 5).

An effective long kick is a kick to a 50/50 or to a pack, while a long kick to advantage means it's a kick that favours a teamate, allowing them to take an uncontested mark (a rare occurance) or possibly even a mark on lead (I'm not 100 % sure when it becomes 'to advantage').
 
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Darkie

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Oh right. I must be getting old and senile but I thought for him to gain points via an effective kick, it needs to go to his teammate, not to a contest where the ball is in dispute. Might need to brush up on the sc pts scoring system o_O

Edit: moved to scoring thread
Editx2: ok found it. The amount of pts might’ve changed but the kick classification probably hasn’t changed.



There is a distinct difference between an effective long kick (1 point from a kick in or 3 in general play) and a long kick to advantage (3 or 5).

An effective long kick is a kick to a 50/50 or to a pack, while a long kick to advantage means it's a kick that favours a teamate, allowing them to take an uncontested mark (a rare occurance) or possibly even a mark on lead (I'm not 100 % sure when it becomes 'to advantage').
So my memory of it wasn’t quite right (a long turnover wouldn’t qualify) ... good to know, thanks!
 

Rowsus

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Gawn won 55 out of 67 Ruck contests attended.
18 H2A's

How the hell did he only score 110-112 with 19 disposals and 5 marks???!!!

How the hell did Lloyd match him, when Lloyd kept kicking it to the opposition in the last quarter?

I'd be amazingly :mad: .......... if I owned Gawn!
 
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Gawn won 55 out of 67 Ruck contests attended.
18 H2A's

How the hell did he only score 110-112 with 19 disposals and 5 marks???!!!

How the hell did Lloyd match him, when Lloyd kept kicking it to the opposition in the last quarter?

I'd be amazingly :mad: .......... if I owned Gawn!
Absolute garbage, 19 hitouts to advantage as well. 10 CP's, 6 clearances and only 4 clangers. Looks like they stopped giving him points at a stage in the game lol.
 
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