Position SC 2021: Midfielder Discussion

Herbie66 · 11 Feb 2021

@Juzzo

Hi mate

How do you seem them all fitting in ?

Suspect Crouch , Laird , Sloane will be the main mids with Keays starting wing then play the run with role.

Milera , Seedsman , Smith all "want" extra mid time.

Jones , McHenry , Schoenberg need to keep being developed in the mids.

Hately arrives.

Mackay somewhere , Brown lockdown.

Hamill , MacPherson & Sholl as well.

HB/M/W is getting awfully crowded.

McAdam , Murphy , Rowe small forwards.

Himmelberg , Lynch , Tex......where is Fog ? Thilthorpe ?

ROB ruck.

Doedee , Kelly , Talia down back.

Worrell ?

EDIT: forgot McAsey

wogitalia · 11 Feb 2021

Backbone said:

It's a big jump but I think he's as capable as anyone. He's the guy I'd be backing to do an Oliver if he's let off the leash, several tagging jobs last year did deflate the average a bit but at the end he's only gone past 110 three times last year and that's really what you'd have to be aiming at for him.

Juzzo · 11 Feb 2021

Herbie66 said:

Hi Herb,

Your guess as good as mine. I really haven't been following all the intricasies closely yet. No doubt Hately gets midfield time. I suspect all the kids will get plenty of minutes this year. Sorry, not much help. Drew and co. may be able to give you more!

Herbie66 · 11 Feb 2021

Juzzo said:

hahaha what good are you then ? 😀

I will have to go down West Lakes and have a chat to the big Texan then 😀

wogitalia · 11 Feb 2021

Herbie66 said:

Crows 22 is really hard. Talia and Doedee are two down back, McAsey, Kelly and McPherson probably playing for the 3rd tall spot. Smith and Brown take two of the back spots, Sholl looked really good and would have a head start for the 3rd for mine.

Mids I think we see Milera/Smith (reckon one is HB and one W, not sure it matters which is where) and Seedsman on the wings if they're fit. Hateley, Laird, Crouch, Sloane and Keays would be the main mids right now, probably a couple of spots up in the air.

Forwards I think Lynch and Tex probably play when fit, not sure either should, Himmelberg has to get first shot if his preseason is solid after how well he finished last year. Fog and Lynch probably both tweener enough to play both. McAdam took a spot for mine last year, Murphy probably another. Stengle up in the air would have been ahead, opens the door for Davis, Jones, McHenry et al.

Mackay will probably weasel into a spot somewhere, somehow, I've left him out of best 22s for about a decade and he keeps playing! Thilthorpe interesting whether they blood him, big kid who looks ready, would start forward though.

No idea on the kids like Newchurch and the likes and how ready they are but reckon we see at least one rookie in the mix.

Rough guess at the 22 would look :

B Brown Talia Kelly
HB Smith Doedee Sholl
C Milera Crouch Seedsman
HF Sloane Lynch McAdam
F Himmelberg Walker Murphy
R ROB Laird Hately

Int - Keays

Reckon the 3 bench spots are wide open, expect a fit Hamill, Mackay, Fog and Stengle (if available) would be the early leaders but not sure about any of them and could be a good selection of others.

Edit: haven't followed closely to know if anyone is carrying injuries that eliminate them for round one.

Toothless Tigers · 11 Feb 2021

Pre-season report card: Inside midfielders
https://www.carltonfc.com.au/news/861202/pre-season-report-card-inside-midfielders

GrainFedBeef · 11 Feb 2021

Toothless Tigers said:

Notable the comment on more players going through the middle, 6 is just the inside players. No mention of Walsh, expected given outside run.

Lower rotations will have a detrimental impact on midfielder roles, picking who is likely to have the least rotations, be put on the wing or not spend 40% forward will be meaningful.

Partly Danger (when fit) and Dunkley are a bit more attractive as at least they are fwd's.

Not getting excited by every player mentioned in the mids, Rozee, Butters, Duggan etc. Guys like Neale Olivier Steele maybe look ok, Cripps mixed, Rowell ok, Walsh ok however purely outside could hurt him.

Professor · 11 Feb 2021

https://twitter.com/i/web/status/1359645045389889539

Under The Dome · 11 Feb 2021

Toothless Tigers said:

Cripp's comment is gold.

https://twitter.com/i/web/status/1359306589564403712

wogitalia · 12 Feb 2021

Toothless Tigers said:

GrainFedBeef said:

Lack of Walsh is a huge worry for mine. Really flourished in that role. As an outside mid he doesn't get enough and his poor kicking makes it very hard to post big scores even when he did. The move inside showed so much improvement in his game last year it's really surprising if they move him back outside into a role that just doesn't suit him other than being fit.

Williams and Stocker are both big positives, Stocker as a DEF rookie would be very much in play with an inside mid role. Williams listed here is a great sign for his role. I'm still not 100% convinced it's actually a better role for him than HBF but it's a prime opportunity and most importantly he sounds fit.

The Saltshaker · 12 Feb 2021

..

The Rowell factor

Lets take his last game out where injured in first 6minutes.

Upon debut, first 4 games (reduced to 16mins) he had

21.5disp (25.8 adjusted by 120% if normal 20mins)

12.25cont poss (7th behind neale at 12.42 in 2020)

adjusted is 14.69 cp avg 6th behind Cunnington in 2019.

Kicked 6 goals @ 1.5 avg which is 15th overall 2020. Placing him 1st amongst midfielders. Dusty avg 1.10 is next best mid.

Adjusted its 1.8avg or 18th overall in 2019. Ahead of Dusty 1.39avg, again next best mid.
Tackles 6.5avg is 2nd per game 2020 behind Greenwood at 6.88avg.

Adjusted is 7.8avg or 2nd per game behind Steele 8.20avg in 2019.
Clearances 4.5avg which is 28th overall, ahead of Danger and Titch. Neale finished 5th at 5.47avg clearances, so roughly 1 clearance per game less.

Adjusted is 5.4avg or 30th overall behind Brad Crouch. in 2019. So in excellent company.
His Disposal Effeciency, is 72.9%, Lachie Neale 72.09% with Titch & A.Brayshaw the top mids at 75.75% in 2020.

-----
2020 Supercoach Score (per game avg)

1st Gawn 92.57% TOG for 139.86 sc

2nd Neale 92.26% TOG for 133.74sc

3rd Rowell 77.00% TOG for 124.25sc
If he had equiv TOG that is 124.25 x 115% at 92% TOG

142.88sc
Remembering SC is an impact game, going at 100% b.o.g in their wins.

----- of course its a small sample, this is how they scream about Climate Alarmism ----- ✌

The Saltshaker · 12 Feb 2021

Im liking 🤔

Treloar at the doggies, not worried about his soft tissue, had massive 2019. Doggies players got together to watch his highlights, they know they got a gem. Ball magnet. Point to prove, been training strongly as has Dunkley.

- like Dunks this year, strong tackler, had niggles early last year more than anything. Bevo gave him plenty of CBAs (91% first 3 games and wasnt working). Diff roles thru season. Apparently was getting possies at will in practice match thru mid.

- Gaff, had 95% TOG last year, #1 for mids. Will stay on ground for long periods again in 2020 with reduced Interchange.

- Rockpig, had big finish avg 114sc over last 11 games. 5th in tackles per game 6.2. Turned back the clock having some 30disp games, 10 & 15 tackles so going both offense & defense. Has come back lighter, and running well, training well. (I did say never again, but think wants a flag, Port keen to get it this year).

- Cripps looks strong, expect will hold down Centre role, had 89% TOG in 2019, still 1st in centre clearances in 2020. Well priced.

- Taranto - has the numbers from 2019 came 2nd in 2km time trial, watching at this stage. But if returns to 2019 levels a steal.

- Sidebottom should be fresh, new family, came 7th AF/DT avg score at 91, which is high (Crouch was 88.4) so best of fwds by fair way.
Dunks 77.1, Dusty 75.4, Marshall 76.9, Danger 77,

GrainFedBeef · 12 Feb 2021

The Saltshaker said:

Im liking 🤔

Treloar at the doggies, not worried about his soft tissue, had massive 2019. Doggies players got together to watch his highlights, they know they got a gem. Ball magnet. Point to prove, been training strongly as has Dunkley.

- like Dunks this year, strong tackler, had niggles early last year more than anything. Bevo gave him plenty of CBAs (91% first 3 games and wasnt working). Diff roles thru season. Apparently was getting possies at will in practice match thru mid.

- Gaff, had 95% TOG last year, #1 for mids. Will stay on ground for long periods again in 2020 with reduced Interchange.

- Rockpig, had big finish avg 114sc over last 11 games. 5th in tackles per game 6.2. Turned back the clock having some 30disp games, 10 & 15 tackles so going both offense & defense. Has come back lighter, and running well, training well. (I did say never again, but think wants a flag, Port keen to get it this year).

- Cripps looks strong, expect will hold down Centre role, had 89% TOG in 2019, still 1st in centre clearances in 2020. Well priced.

- Taranto - has the numbers from 2019 came 2nd in 2km time trial, watching at this stage. But if returns to 2019 levels a steal.

- Sidebottom should be fresh, new family, came 7th AF/DT avg score at 91, which is high (Crouch was 88.4) so best of fwds by fair way.
Dunks 77.1, Dusty 75.4, Marshall 76.9, Danger 77,

The Dunks comment is interesting. Why do you say it wasnt working. Trying to work out if Dunks role changed due to injury where he may have been managed all season in forward line due to ongoing ligament injury risk.

jaca · 12 Feb 2021

I keep circling Fyfe and Jelly. Am I destined for a few weeks of my head in my hands crying?!

PC · 12 Feb 2021

jaca said:

Yes.

froffershanners · 12 Feb 2021

jaca said:

Easy to keep cycling back to absolute guns like that. Their scoring history is very impressive. Problem is they just always seem to miss games and never really for the same reasons either. So at least it is not something chronic you're banking on not coming back again. I'm pretty keen to start Jelly again this year, strap me in for the ride!

Jelly's lowest score last year outside of his concussion game was 89. Then only had two other games below 100 (not including his concussion game). Did almost identical in 2019 as well. Problem is the missed games. Would love some positive training reports or just something. Not sure I can ride with the no news equals good news until round 1.

Zoku Pops · 12 Feb 2021

jaca said:

Ditto. I'm struggling to pick midefielders and keep coming back to these two who are both reasonably priced for their potential.

Don't necessarily want to do it given their injury history, but it's mighty tempting. Also love watching both play, so that makes them harder to continue to ignore.

Goodie's Guns · 12 Feb 2021

froffershanners said:

It’s not much, but believe Kelly ran a GWS record time trial first session back after Xmas.

Juzzo · 12 Feb 2021

Zoku Pops said:

I think sometimes it's hard to move on from these older elite picks because they have just been fixtures in our teams for years. But I think we have to now go with the new brigade, eg, Steele, Petracca and co.

jaca · 12 Feb 2021

Josh Kelly is 25.

Position SC 2021: Midfielder Discussion

Which ‘keepers’ are you planning on starting with?

Neale

Oliver

Macrae

Bontempelli

Merrett

Fyfe

Cripps

Rowell

Taranto

Other

Herbie66

wogitalia

Juzzo

Herbie66

wogitalia

Toothless Tigers

GrainFedBeef

Professor

Under The Dome

wogitalia

The Saltshaker

The Saltshaker

GrainFedBeef

jaca

PC

froffershanners

Zoku Pops

Goodie's Guns

Leadership Group

Juzzo

jaca