Position 2021: Ruck Discussion

[Robhans]

Real easy to pick a team with the benefit of hindsight

Lotsa people did pick Flynn at r2, without the benefit of hindsight... and lots picked Gawndy-Flynn. It can be useful to compare the outcomes, with more information, to get better at the game. Or don't bother, up to you.

I always throw together an AFL fantasy and DT with the moves I didn't have the balls to make in SC. In each this year I started Hickey, Flynn, Meek/Hunter. Ahh the benefit of foresight + commitment to it.

 

[Johnsy44]

If I could go back, I think I would go Hickey, Flynn and Meek

 

[freowho]

Grundy, Flynn, Meek and Treacy in the forwards is my hindsight choice with Grundy's draw opening up and the ability to VC. The only donut I've copped is Sharp who was useless last round anyway. I know it can happen but those with Grundy have been blessed with McInerney, Draper and Witts all injured and covid in Brisbane. I think those without Grundy should at least have a plan post NicNat in Perth to bring him in. Or start stabbing your voodoo doll.

 

[jobeywatto]

Any other 550-660k player that you might've picked adds up to more points. Even Kelly, who I started :'( Gawn-Flynn-Kelly is averaging 329 points per round. Gawn-Grundy-Berry 315. If you spent the money on Dunks, Ridley, etc, then it's an even bigger win.

You also have to consider captaincy. I don't know how you would factor it into the numbers and how it would affect the averages, but Gawn and Grundy both being captain options whereas Kelly/most other 550k-650k options aren't has to count for something.

But yeah, on the raw numbers other combinations might be winning at the moment. Even so, I'm still happy with Gawndy going forward.

 

[wogitalia]

I think with Flynn scoring 90 odd and Grawndy scoring 160, it’s probably the rare scenario where both sides are sitting happily.

This was the round where Flynn was supposed to score 50 but that hasn’t eventuated.

Think it’s now fairly even tbh but I’m happier sitting on Grawndy so I can focus on grabbing some of the cheaper mids like Neale and Oliver in coming weeks. But the swing in R2 and R3 is exactly what Grawndy owners would have hoped for. Hope no one did a R2 restructure!

The unconsidered factor right now is, touch wood, how much better Meek looks than the Brockman/Sharp picks at F8/D8 from a cash generation perspective which was always a big reason why you'd go the ruck rookies.

That Flynn has been a top 2 rookie, considerably higher than most others, is also a huge bonus. Gawn and Grundy are providing fair value, given their fixtures and the expected scores that's actually a pretty poor result.

Basically unless you cocked up the expenditure of the extra cash you should be well ahead from starting with only one of Gawn/Grundy and taking Meek and Flynn. Of course this year it's been pretty easy to cock up some of those starting picks!

I fully expect Meek to get dropped now to completely derail this even if he was one of Freo's best on the weekend

 

[Bomber18]

The unconsidered factor right now is, touch wood, how much better Meek looks than the Brockman/Sharp picks at F8/D8 from a cash generation perspective which was always a big reason why you'd go the ruck rookies.

That Flynn has been a top 2 rookie, considerably higher than most others, is also a huge bonus. Gawn and Grundy are providing fair value, given their fixtures and the expected scores that's actually a pretty poor result.

Basically unless you cocked up the expenditure of the extra cash you should be well ahead from starting with only one of Gawn/Grundy and taking Meek and Flynn. Of course this year it's been pretty easy to cock up some of those starting picks!

I fully expect Meek to get dropped now to completely derail this even if he was one of Freo's best on the weekend

Do agree re Meek but I think the two rucks haven’t been working for Freo. Jones destroyed the resting ruck so Freo need a proper fwd in that slot (maybe Traecy...?)

 

[Inside50]

If I could go back, I think I would go Hickey, Flynn and Meek

agree, but not sure I’m game enough to correct to that now

 

[jobeywatto]

This probably doesn't count for much, but pretty much every Freo supporter I've seen talking about their team for next week on BigFooty is expecting Meek to be dropped for Treacy. Some don't care if it's Darcy dropped instead, but the consensus seems to be that they can't keep playing that two ruck combination.

 

[Bomber18]

This probably doesn't count for much, but pretty much every Freo supporter I've seen talking about their team for next week on BigFooty is expecting Meek to be dropped for Treacy. Some don't care if it's Darcy dropped instead, but the consensus seems to be that they can't keep playing that two ruck combination.

Agree with this. I watched the game and commentators and anyone watching could see Jones just completely destroy the resting ruck. 16 Intercept Possessions to Jones.

Fair chance it’ll be Meek out for Traecy but one of Darcy and Meek would probably need to drop out.

 

[Johnsy44]

This probably doesn't count for much, but pretty much every Freo supporter I've seen talking about their team for next week on BigFooty is expecting Meek to be dropped for Treacy. Some don't care if it's Darcy dropped instead, but the consensus seems to be that they can't keep playing that two ruck combination.

What a wonderful think that Freo play the last game of the round...

 

[wogitalia]

Do agree re Meek but I think the two rucks haven’t been working for Freo. Jones destroyed the resting ruck so Freo need a proper fwd in that slot (maybe Traecy...?)

This probably doesn't count for much, but pretty much every Freo supporter I've seen talking about their team for next week on BigFooty is expecting Meek to be dropped for Treacy. Some don't care if it's Darcy dropped instead, but the consensus seems to be that they can't keep playing that two ruck combination.

The epitome of lazy media personalities looking at a symptom rather than the cause and then blaming the wrong person.

Darcy and Meek was a genuine advantage for Freo and were two of their best. That their midfield kept kicking it to their disadvantage or flat out to Jones isn't the resting rucks fault at all. It's funny they're blaming the guys playing as the 2nd tall who actually presented and not the lazy crab that is Taberner who didn't bother to get on his bike at all for the game.

That said, they should be bringing in another forward target, having Darcy/Meek as their only forward target is a massive problem, replacing them with an even more inexperienced option isn't going to change that, as long as Taberner isn't even playing despite being named and that they refuse to lower their eyes and hit up the small leading targets it wouldn't matter if they had Carey out there.

Problem was Walters, Schultz, Frederick, Switkoski and Colyer were also not presenting options so the only guys who actually presented get kicked to even when it's a 3 on 1 all day.

Mostly though their midfield pressure was pathetic and that was the biggest factor, if you put no pressure on the opposition midfield and then kick rushed to the outnumber over and over again, things are going to be ugly.

FWIW... Darcy and Meek were 3rd and 4th for Freo in tackles, tied for 3rd in clearances and 2nd and 3rd in contested possessions. It's probably time to look at the guys at their feet who all had absolute stinkers rather than the rucks who more than pulled their weight. Brayshaw, Serong, Cerra, Acres and Aish have all had absolute mares.

That said, always go with "AFL coaches are stupid and will make the dumb decision" as an expectation and you'll very rarely be surprised by the outcome so I fully expect that one of them pays the price for the midfield's incompetence.

 

[Gruffles]

With round 3 hindsight I would stick to Gawn Flynn Meek, never actually considered Hickey.
Grundy Hickey Flynn the combo I would start if I had my do-over.

 

[Dimmawit]

Loving the Meek talk. Gonna be interesting to see what happens there. He's looked good it'd be a shame to see him dropped. For the Flynn R2 owners (me included) Meek's cash gen is pretty key. If Gawndy vs. Rookie R2 is a close call atm (arguably) Meek being dropped would swing it to Gawndy wouldn't it

 

[Herbie66]

After Round 3 (points)

Gawn 393
Grundy 367
Hickey 314
Naitanui 310
Flynn 307

 

[Montyjnr]

Hate not having Meek right now.

Hopefully I feel differently this time next week.

 

[Manikato1]

In round 1 Freo did exactly the same thing as they did this round. Long bombs into the fwd line and they got the same result. I agree with @wogitalia in that Freo did not give there fwds much chance with that kind of delivery. I hope they keep Meek in the team. I think he has a lot of upside, more than Darcy and they needs to bring him on as quickly as they can. Having said that I am bias as I have Gawn, Flynn and Meek R3.

 

[freowho]

Loving the Meek talk. Gonna be interesting to see what happens there. He's looked good it'd be a shame to see him dropped. For the Flynn R2 owners (me included) Meek's cash gen is pretty key. If Gawndy vs. Rookie R2 is a close call atm (arguably) Meek being dropped would swing it to Gawndy wouldn't it

Grundy, Flynn, Treacy might still beat Gawndy. Flynn on the ground would be a win and Teacy might still be a good captains loophole donut to play and make some cash.

 

[Professor]

The epitome of lazy media personalities looking at a symptom rather than the cause and then blaming the wrong person.

Darcy and Meek was a genuine advantage for Freo and were two of their best. That their midfield kept kicking it to their disadvantage or flat out to Jones isn't the resting rucks fault at all. It's funny they're blaming the guys playing as the 2nd tall who actually presented and not the lazy crab that is Taberner who didn't bother to get on his bike at all for the game.

That said, they should be bringing in another forward target, having Darcy/Meek as their only forward target is a massive problem, replacing them with an even more inexperienced option isn't going to change that, as long as Taberner isn't even playing despite being named and that they refuse to lower their eyes and hit up the small leading targets it wouldn't matter if they had Carey out there.

Problem was Walters, Schultz, Frederick, Switkoski and Colyer were also not presenting options so the only guys who actually presented get kicked to even when it's a 3 on 1 all day.

Mostly though their midfield pressure was pathetic and that was the biggest factor, if you put no pressure on the opposition midfield and then kick rushed to the outnumber over and over again, things are going to be ugly.

FWIW... Darcy and Meek were 3rd and 4th for Freo in tackles, tied for 3rd in clearances and 2nd and 3rd in contested possessions. It's probably time to look at the guys at their feet who all had absolute stinkers rather than the rucks who more than pulled their weight. Brayshaw, Serong, Cerra, Acres and Aish have all had absolute mares.

That said, always go with "AFL coaches are stupid and will make the dumb decision" as an expectation and you'll very rarely be surprised by the outcome so I fully expect that one of them pays the price for the midfield's incompetence.

JL has confirmed there will be changes, Treacy should come in with Sturt who kicked 5 for Peel I think it was, now who goes out, not sure, Darcy or Meek or Tab?

 

[Manikato1]

JL has confirmed there will be changes, Treacy should come in with Sturt who kicked 5 for Peel I think it was, now who goes out, not sure, Darcy or Meek or Tab?

I would like to see Taberner go. He has been a round the block a few times and played some good games but had plenty of games where he just has not turned up. Treacey for him. The issue is when Lobb comes back which is supposed to be sooner than originally expected. Then they have too any talls for too few spots. Like to see Treacey get a shot at it and get the opportunity take his chance.

 

[Goodie's Guns]

JL has confirmed there will be changes, Treacy should come in with Sturt who kicked 5 for Peel I think it was, now who goes out, not sure, Darcy or Meek or Tab?

I would like to see Taberner go. He has been a round the block a few times and played some good games but had plenty of games where he just has not turned up. Treacey for him. The issue is when Lobb comes back which is supposed to be sooner than originally expected. Then they have too any talls for too few spots. Like to see Treacey get a shot at it and get the opportunity take his chance.

Matthew Taberner, the Fremantle forward who kicked at least one goal in every game he played bar one last year, and was in the All Australian squad of 40?

He has 7 goals in three games this year, is a fantastic contested mark, and you want to drop him for an 18 year old kid who hasn't played an official competitive game in the best part of two years.

Seems like a massive knee jerk reaction on Taberner. Fremantle are crying out for more decent forward targets, removing their best avenue doesn't seem logical to me.