Discussion General Discussion

Which team wins a final first?

  • Essendon

    Votes: 23 28.4%
  • Tasmania

    Votes: 58 71.6%

  • Total voters
    81
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The complaints about fixturing do my brain in. If WCE and FREO want to travel less they could drop down to the WAFL. You can't do much when 10 teams are here and you play 22 games is a 18 team comp. All you could do is add games to balance things better...then then the players have a cry that it is too many games. Then whinge ohhh they had 6 days off and us only 5. Add games, shorten QTRS ever so slightly. Like 18 minutes a qtr.

When it come to having a crack at the "advantage" vic clubs get, vic clubs don't get 10 games where there is an absoulute clear advantage. Collingwood have no home ground advantage against hawthorn, Richmond, Melbourne. And a slight but very minimal advantage over saints, dogs, north. I cbf searching but I'd imagine carlton and essendon get a decent amount of G games?
Spot on.

Look at Port for instance - that team wouldn't be in the 8 right now if they were a Marvel tenant with no Adelaide Oval fortress.
 
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Isn't this kind of what Gather round has been partially achieving? It's a very hard thing to balance with so many Victorian based teams.
Gather round sort of tries it, but I'm more thinking rather than get all teams in one spot, cluster the away fixtures together and then give a block of home games. Makes no sense to be 1 home, 1 away, back and forth, when they could avoid that long flight frequency and space them out if they did it in clusters.
 
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The complaints about fixturing do my brain in. If WCE and FREO want to travel less they could drop down to the WAFL. You can't do much when 10 teams are here and you play 22 games is a 18 team comp. All you could do is add games to balance things better...then then the players have a cry that it is too many games. Then whinge ohhh they had 6 days off and us only 5. Add games, shorten QTRS ever so slightly. Like 18 minutes a qtr.

When it come to having a crack at the "advantage" vic clubs get, vic clubs don't get 10 games where there is an absolute clear advantage. Collingwood have no home ground advantage against hawthorn, Richmond, Melbourne. And a slight but very minimal advantage over saints, dogs, north. I cbf searching but I'd imagine carlton and essendon get a decent amount of G games?
I tend to disagree, even thought I'm probably also guilty of VIC bias. But if we are a national competition - which we want to be as a significant portion of the funding generated comes from non VIC clubs and the extra games on TV - then we should be finding the most balanced competition we can. West Coast and Fremantle do have a significant disadvantage form travel, and yes they gain an advantage with a home crown bias, VIC teams do still get this when they play interstate teams.

I just think we need to stop thinking of it as the VFL and start embracing the AFL - it's bad enough that the grand final is at the MCG every year which is a monumental advantage to tenant clubs regardless of ladder position. Wasn't there a huge narrative about how Brisbane can't win at the G, and how they need to fix that because the GF is at the G.. what if they finished top? or were the top ranked team in the game?

It'll never be fair, because money trumps all else and the fixture is designed to make money then be fair, not be fair as the #1, but we sure as hell could be doing more to close the gap.
 

Darkie

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Gather round sort of tries it, but I'm more thinking rather than get all teams in one spot, cluster the away fixtures together and then give a block of home games. Makes no sense to be 1 home, 1 away, back and forth, when they could avoid that long flight frequency and space them out if they did it in clusters.
Clustering matches would be more efficient from a travel perspective, but is potentially a lot worse for players who have families. From memory a high percentage of the Eagles have children (assuming it hasn’t changed dramatically from 2020-21 - probably declined somewhat with the rebuild).
 
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so lets come up with a fair fixture

Collingwood can play every non-Victorian team twice per season (once at the G and once at their venue) = 16 games

9 teams left

let's say we play Carlton , Essendon , North Melbourne , Richmond , St Kilda & Western Bulldogs all at Marvel every year

Hawthorn , Melbourne , North Melbourne at the G

Leaves Geelong down at Kardinia Park (reverse venue next season)

Home Games v Interstate Opponents at the G = 8
Home Games v MCG tenants at the G = 3

Away Games v Interstate Opponents = 8
Away Games v Marvel tenants = 5

v Geelong Away & Home alternate years

25 game season is the answer , no double up on blockbusters, don't need to worry about limited crowds at Marvel

Same basis (I guess) applies to the other Victorian clubs

not sure how it works for the non-Victorian clubs, theoretically they would get at least 8 games in Melbourne each year though
I felt like it was a big set-up to try and get Collingwood to never leave Victoria, and had to read it three times in case I was missing something. I'm disappointed now!
 
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I tend to disagree, even thought I'm probably also guilty of VIC bias. But if we are a national competition - which we want to be as a significant portion of the funding generated comes from non VIC clubs and the extra games on TV - then we should be finding the most balanced competition we can. West Coast and Fremantle do have a significant disadvantage form travel, and yes they gain an advantage with a home crown bias, VIC teams do still get this when they play interstate teams.

I just think we need to stop thinking of it as the VFL and start embracing the AFL - it's bad enough that the grand final is at the MCG every year which is a monumental advantage to tenant clubs regardless of ladder position. Wasn't there a huge narrative about how Brisbane can't win at the G, and how they need to fix that because the GF is at the G.. what if they finished top? or were the top ranked team in the game?

It'll never be fair, because money trumps all else and the fixture is designed to make money then be fair, not be fair as the #1, but we sure as hell could be doing more to close the gap.
How many interstate teams do the bulldogs play at marvel vs freo at Perth oval?
 
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Clustering matches would be more efficient from a travel perspective, but is potentially a lot worse for players who have families. From memory a high percentage of the Eagles have children (assuming it hasn’t changed dramatically from 2020-21 - probably declined somewhat with the rebuild).
Actually very fair point!
 
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God I feel like there could be a separate thread for fixture chats and it would blow up! Hard to see a fair fixture given the number of factors that compromise it (10 VIC teams, travel factor for interstate clubs, blockbuster match ups, small number of double match ups, etc).

Would love to see the AFL explore some things to balance it out more though. One thing that has always struck me is the Home, Away, Home, Away cycle for interstate clubs. Yes I get wanting to give fans a home game regularly, but would be interesting if they explored "road trips" in the same way they do in some American sports. West Coat fly over to the east coast, maybe play 1-2 Melbourne teams, a Sydney team, etc), and then fly home for a block of 3-4 home games in a row. Would significantly cut down on the travel times if they don't need to do the long flight as frequently, and with the right resourcing and support it could work.

But yeah, lots of options!
It's a interesting concept , what would the cost be though relocating the entire football staff though for a 2-3 week block ?

Astronomical

Players , trainers , coaches , support staff etc etc
 
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How many interstate teams do the bulldogs play at marvel vs freo at Perth oval?
There are a million “oh but this team is more hard done by scenarios” but anyone who can’t appreciate that the difficulty of flying to Perth and back every 2 weeks is a completely different but substantial issue is probably too clouded by supporter bias.
Yes some Victorian clubs are hard done by in some ways, but they rarely need to be away from home, rarely need to play off a long flight, rarely need to back up or have compromised recovery due to travel.

Anyway happy to leave it there.
 
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It's a interesting concept , what would the cost be though relocating the entire football staff though for a 2-3 week block ?

Astronomical

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Yeah might be cheaper to just give every state a dedicated plan designed to make the travel factor as minimally disruptive as possible!
 
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I felt like it was a big set-up to try and get Collingwood to never leave Victoria, and had to read it three times in case I was missing something. I'm disappointed now!
Sorry to disappoint you

Eddie had the right idea

11 home games at the G

11 away games at Homebush

More 👀's that can watch us play the better 🤗
 
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Yeah might be cheaper to just give every state a dedicated plan designed to make the travel factor as minimally disruptive as possible!
I think it was Freo who tried it a few years ago with back-to-back Melbourne games and stayed in between the matches but found it to expensive and too disruptive to routine.

I like the idea of Gather Round , was talk of them having 2-3 more each season , not sure if that spoils the concept though or "over kills it".

Unfortunately having 10 teams in 1 state , they will never come up with an idea that satisfies everyone , and money will be the bottom line.

Was reading WA doesn't want the license for the 20th team so whether it becomes a standalone NT side , a 3rd SA team or a combined SA/NT/Northern QLD entity remains to be seen.

Interesting that PNG is going to be getting a side in the NRL in the near future.

I wish CA had involved PNG (and Hong Kong) in our domestic one day setup and included them in the BBL , be unreal to have games overseas
 
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There are a million “oh but this team is more hard done by scenarios” but anyone who can’t appreciate that the difficulty of flying to Perth and back every 2 weeks is a completely different but substantial issue is probably too clouded by supporter bias.
Yes some Victorian clubs are hard done by in some ways, but they rarely need to be away from home, rarely need to play off a long flight, rarely need to back up or have compromised recovery due to travel.

Anyway happy to leave it there.
Not in the least clouded by supporter bias or vic bias here. I find the whole league as a whole, whinge and moan constantly about anything and everything. You have to deal with the facts. There are now 23 games in a season. Previously 22. Broadcasterd Every side is and should be entitled to host half of their matches. No team should have to lose the right to host any game because professional athletes think a 4 hour flight is taxing.
 

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I really think the AFL need to revisit the 50m Penalty rule.
Originally brought in because players were retarding the player with the free kick/mark, so they couldn't move it on quickly, knowing it would only result in a 15m Penalty.
Now we can see a player 5m away from the man with ball, AND moving away from him, get pinged, and the player goes from 70m out, to 20m out!!!! Ridiculous penalty, when he was having no affect on the ball holder moving the game on!!!!
Worse still, the player on the mark takes a half step backwards or sideways? 50m!!!!
If it's not really causing a hold up, or a distinct disadvantage to the team with the ball, it just shouldn't be a 50m.
They need to look at why they brought in the rule, and rethink how it is being applied today.
It's absolutely ruining the game, when it is being applied to the most innocuous things you'll ever see!!!!
Some umpires seem to be using it, to make a "I'm in charge, not you!" statement.
 
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