Position Forward Discussion

[Professor]

https://twitter.com/i/web/status/1228080289261350912

 

[Ratzondix]

No talk at all about Toby Greene, and I can understand the probable reasons why. At his best he's easily top 3-4 FWD and finished last year in a blaze at 111.7 for his last 9 matches. At 26 yo has he finally reached a level of maturity that will keep his worst impulses under control on the field ? I love him as a footballer and inevitably find myself putting him in my team as a starter more often than not. You take the good with the bad when it comes to Toby but the main concern for me is his dispersion of scores. He rarely gets scores in the 90s, they are either putrid (for him) sub 90s efforts or big tons. It's never boring that's for sure but I see him as possibly a better starter than Dusty who is almost always slow off the blocks and therefore a R8-10 upgrade target. Anyone else thinking about Toby ?

Ruined 2 seasons for me. Never again list.

 

[pizza safety]

Starting to warm a bit to the Wingard pick only because he's as cheap as he is but I will try my best to avoid him given his history as a burn man.

Looks set to play midfield this year as he's been training with the mids and played there at the back end of last year.

Will have a look at him if other options get injured.

 

[pizza safety]

No talk at all about Toby Greene, and I can understand the probable reasons why. At his best he's easily top 3-4 FWD and finished last year in a blaze at 111.7 for his last 9 matches. At 26 yo has he finally reached a level of maturity that will keep his worst impulses under control on the field ? I love him as a footballer and inevitably find myself putting him in my team as a starter more often than not. You take the good with the bad when it comes to Toby but the main concern for me is his dispersion of scores. He rarely gets scores in the 90s, they are either putrid (for him) sub 90s efforts or big tons. It's never boring that's for sure but I see him as possibly a better starter than Dusty who is almost always slow off the blocks and therefore a R8-10 upgrade target. Anyone else thinking about Toby ?

I just don't see any good risk versus reward in picking him.

The massive scores from last year were due to the midfield time he got due to injuries to Ward, Cogs, JKelly and even Matt De Boer. With those guys not injured he will get very little mid time and will play his half-forward flank role.

If he's playing his usual role in the team and he's fit and flying he's going to average between 90-100. That's if he's fit and flying and he's often injured and/or suspended.

To me you're basically paying about as much as his upside as a fit half-forward or only a little bit less because he's priced at 93avg, with the potential for things to go completely wrong. Not something I'd be doing.

If injuries occur to some of the GWS midfield as seems to happen pretty often I think he becomes a pretty relevant trade in target.


Also his history of being a 90-100 avg type player as a half-forward only lasted about 1.5 years, generally these players, like key forwards, struggle to have sustained success. I.e. Billings averaged 93 for a year playing a half-forward role and then fell apart as a scorer in that role, Wingard has put up good scores in that role for seasons and has struggled to do it consistently, Breust put up big numbers in that role in 2018 and failed to back it up in 2019.

 

[Herbie66]

Interesting Footywire shows Greene having 5 seasons of 90+ in his 8 seasons so far.

 

[TopBillings]

Starting to warm a bit to the Wingard pick only because he's as cheap as he is but I will try my best to avoid him given his history as a burn man.

Looks set to play midfield this year as he's been training with the mids and played there at the back end of last year.

Will have a look at him if other options get injured.

+1.

I’m on the Wingard train. Think he’ll play mostly mid this year. 90+ minimum hopefully

 

[TopBillings]

https://twitter.com/i/web/status/1228212689182191616

 

[pizza safety]

+1.

I’m on the Wingard train. Think he’ll play mostly mid this year. 90+ minimum hopefully

It’s still Tom J Lynch for me at F3 but Wingard has become next in line in my mind for that spot. I just don’t trust his body or his consistency enough to start him over Lynch.

 

[TopBillings]

It’s still Tom J Lynch for me at F3 but Wingard has become next in line in my mind for that spot. I just don’t trust his body or his consistency enough to start him over Lynch.

I forgot about Lynch. Pros & cons for both but both capable of 90+ avg

 

[Misky]

Anyone have stats as to what Whitfield scores with/without Jelly and/or any other gun GWS midfielder? Would be interesting to see if there is a correlation...

 

[Ironhawk]

Anyone have stats as to what Whitfield scores with/without Jelly and/or any other gun GWS midfielder? Would be interesting to see if there is a correlation...

2019 Whitfield [16/111]
Without both Kelly & Coniglio: 5/102
With both Kelly & Coniglio: 6/100
With one of Kelly/Coniglio: 5/134

 

[Santoz]

Also his history of being a 90-100 avg type player as a half-forward only lasted about 1.5 years, generally these players, like key forwards, struggle to have sustained success. I.e. Billings averaged 93 for a year playing a half-forward role and then fell apart as a scorer in that role, Wingard has put up good scores in that role for seasons and has struggled to do it consistently, Breust put up big numbers in that role in 2018 and failed to back it up in 2019.

Yeah but Billings plays for St. Kilda ...

 

[Manikato1]

https://twitter.com/i/web/status/1228212689182191616

So if Big Boy is down back does this make Ceglar more relevant in the forward line. Could he ave 90?

 

[Ironhawk]

So if Big Boy is down back does this make Ceglar more relevant in the forward line. Could he ave 90?

I've linked a few articles on the Hawthorn website from last week where McEvoy is not mentioned training with the rucks and they mention other possible options for a second ruck. Pretty safe bet Ceglar is going to be the main ruck for the Hawks this year.

https://www.hawthornfc.com.au/news/560527/the-209cm-ruckman-who-s-still-growing
https://www.hawthornfc.com.au/news/560210/o-brien-s-forward-thinking

 

[Zagbag]

Thanks mate. I probably didn’t articulate it well but I was more focusing on the points-on-field side of things and that you know what you’re getting when you spend $600k on Oliver/Treloar over Whitfield.

Good point about the abundant 110 midfield options though. I’m possibly being too points driven and not taking into account the bigger pool of discounted midfielders I’ll have access to later in the year.

Without derailing the thread, will you be starting Lloyd for similar reasons to Whitfield?

I’m not starting Lloyd - but only because I think the second half of last year was a sign of things to come. I think he could be 10-15 pts overpriced.

That said, he’s probably still a target for the final team.

 

[NT.Thunder]

I’m not starting Lloyd - but only because I think the second half of last year was a sign of things to come. I think he could be 10-15 pts overpriced.

That said, he’s probably still a target for the final team.

Must admit it's a look and see for me but could go either way.

 

[Manikato1]

I've linked a few articles on the Hawthorn website from last week where McEvoy is not mentioned training with the rucks and they mention other possible options for a second ruck. Pretty safe bet Ceglar is going to be the main ruck for the Hawks this year.

https://www.hawthornfc.com.au/news/560527/the-209cm-ruckman-who-s-still-growing
https://www.hawthornfc.com.au/news/560210/o-brien-s-forward-thinking

Thanks @Ironhawk. Thinking about his price however makes Ceglar hard to pick. That is always one of my problems when selecting teams. I see guys I think will or might improve and even if it turns out I was right unless they represent value you cannot pick them.

 

[freowho]

Thanks @Ironhawk. Thinking about his price however makes Ceglar hard to pick. That is always one of my problems when selecting teams. I see guys I think will or might improve and even if it turns out I was right unless they represent value you cannot pick them.

He doesn't play enough games anyway.

 

[Manikato1]

He doesn't play enough games anyway.

I know he did a knee back in 2016 but putting that aside if he is going to be the No 1 ruck at the Hawks he will be. That is the scenario I had in the back of my mind - 22 games at 90 or even 100.

 

[toxic]

The best Ruc/Fwd option is

Ladhams imho.

I'm currently trying to get him into a F4/F5 role